"Outboarding" CJ-7 springs

[Mudrat]

OK, I'm moving my trials and tribulations of outboarding my springs to support transplanting a pair of SOA D-44's under my CJ.



Mudrat, So I take it 11" Ubolts weren't from end to end, but actual length from base of U to the end, eh? I hope they let you return them! You figure out how ya wanna move the perches out yet?


Yup, yup, and ...ah ... uhhh, yup (I think ).
. Haven't had the engineering assesment come back yet on my thoughts, but the front won't be as bad as we thought. Some 1/4 plate and solid welds. I don't have any of the correct diam tubing on hand to fab the swing shackle mounts right now though But I do have a significant qty of 1/4 and 3/16 plate laying around

Mudrat

[jeepsr4ever]

here is from my 85 one of my first weld jobs..ugly but worked great. Outboarding for a chevy or waggy width (non cut down) on a CJ-7 frame moves the centers out exactly 2"S

http://mpcrescenzo.imgbay.com/New17.jpg

[Mudrat]

Dang that's some uuuu-ga-ly stuff there MC!!! (mine is a show Jeep ya know ... NOT!!!)
After brunch I got back to the Jeep. Looks like I cut my frame-plates about 1/4 too wide and I can't bring the springs in far enough to fit 31" centers. :smile: (and me outta OXY for the torch!!)
Plus with the SRS kit it looks like I'll have to 'notch' the front hangers just over 1/4 in to go around the bolts, then figure out how to reenforce the inner plate since I'll be cutting thru the weld to notch the dang things :!:
I still need to find some tubing to fit the poly bushings for the rear swing shackles which will raise things a bit further by at least 2"s!!
and install the new BT shackles outback (hopefully longer than stock) - when they get here :?

'Rat


here is from my 85 one of my first weld jobs..ugly but worked great. Outboarding for a chevy or waggy width (non cut down) on a CJ-7 frame moves the centers out exactly 2"S

[Mudrat]

OK, more trials and tribulations and just down right pissed off!!

First the day started OK, computer crashed at work so I'm home by 1PM
Started on the Jeep and UPS delivered my rims - Black Rock Crawlers
Not as purdy as Fuzz's though.
So while they are being mounted I work on the spring perches.
For the passenger side I had to cut the weld out to fit the mounting bolts
And then I welded in a new stiffining plate. I really like my MIG when I have gasssssss :?
OK, I then picked up the tires and stuck one up next to the Jeep to see how they'd fit. OMG!!! What have I gotten myself into here!!! I still have to jack the Jeep up another 5 inches to match the studs!!!!

So I figure I'd put the new calipers and shoes in and mount them - this is where REALLY 8) pissed off comes in.

Chased the studs, put on the rotor and TRIED to fit the caliper and shoes. It looks like the caliper mount is tweeked so the shoes don't fit squarely and I can't get the bolts in - even using a hammer!!!

Thats when I quit before I really broke something, and did some family type stuff.

Suggestions are welcome....

Mudrat

[jeepsr4ever]

Nice pretty foo foo mounts

The brackets..........man they are bent!?

[Mudrat]

Nice pretty foo foo mounts

The brackets..........man they are bent!?

Hey, they were part of the MORE shackle reverse kit ;-) They actually are a good foundation to build off of ... but what about SUGGESTIONS???? That was the purpose behind this thread :wink:

Mud

[jeepsr4ever]

Midevil remedy:

install your caliper to the best of your ability without brake pad, find out which side is tweaked inward towards the pumpkin, Gently BANG the mount to straiten it

Are they bolt on or welded on?

[Mudrat]

The brackets..........man they are bent!?

Appears either bent or welded crooked??




Midevil remedy:

install your caliper to the best of your ability without brake pad, find out which side is tweaked inward towards the pumpkin, Gently BANG the mount to straiten it

Are they bolt on or welded on?

Welded - Tried to be gentle since this puppy is on jack stands and it's already pissed me off. I didn't want it to come crashing down on me and REALLLY piss me off!!!

Don't now if you can see it in the front pics, but the front stands are behind the swing shackle and the rear stands are under the axle - not a lot of horizontal seperation 111!!!
As Jack kept reminding himself when he was here, "Don't touch the Jeep, Don't touch the Jeep"

It looks like the top section is the problem and the weld is an UUUUUggaaallly one. Huge beads. It'll take some serious grinding (still haven't gotten gas for the torch) to get it off to move it.

And my PC at work is still givingme problems but I can't afford another day off. got to get this project finished today so I can take next week off in FL!! (75 and sunny today :smile: )

Mudrat

[jeepsr4ever]

for a friend

http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_820346.html

[Barry Kaul]

What is the benefit of having the springs mounted out board of the frame?

[jeepsr4ever]

It is just so you can run a fullsize axle without cutting it down for stock spring locations on the frame

[Barry Kaul]

Gotcha. I was thinking about running full size axles on my CJ since I have some lying around. Is outboarding the springs easier than moving the spring perches on the axle? Mudrat, are you going to mas produce your brackets and mounts? :t:

[Tigger]

Gotcha. I was thinking about running full size axles on my CJ since I have some lying around. Is outboarding the springs easier than moving the spring perches on the axle? Mudrat, are you going to mas produce your brackets and mounts? :t:

Yeah Mud.... I may need some also.....

the problem you have with a CJ and Full width axles is if you try to move the spring perches you run into the pumpkin wiht the perch or its really close and you are welding steel to cast.

[Barry Kaul]

Yeah, I've heard of that but didn't know for sure.

[Mudrat]

Ooouuuhhhh on the spot here - I don't have time to finish my own rig let alone build extras!!! If I had some help I might consider building a few, but right now? Not possible.

I had the MORE front frame plates I welded on when I refinished the frame and installed the SRS on the D30's. That combination changed the math some what because I now had an exta 3/8" on the outside of each frame rail. And with the "foo foo" mounts ( 8) mc! :wink: ) that bolted on through and under the frame (and the steering gear box), I had to play with it awhile, but wound up with two 4.5x 4.2 inch plates as a foundation to weld the front SRS to. I was looking at keeping everything removable for some strange reason??? When I get back to it, the swing shackle that used to go thru the frame is going to get an off set H with gussets welded on. Basically a U on top with the inverse U offset for the spring. This will change some of the geometry of the font end with basically be a small "shackle lift" in the back of the front springs because I'm going from inside the frame to under the frame.
Total offset for me was 1.87 inches. MC said "normally" it's about 2" outboard on each side to fit wider D44 axles.

For the SOA, there is room on the 44's to weld the perch. It's close to the pumpkin and you need 3.5" U-bolts for that corner, but the rest are 3" and you need them ~ 7" long on that corner so. I didn't find any ready made spring plates so I made some out of 1/4 inch. Cousre I need a new drill press now!!! My little 8" hobby press is wabbling kind wierd ya know?!?! :oops: I got 5/8 x 7 inchers all around with a wild thought of using the extra length to mount hydraulic bump stops instead of the rubber/poly snubbers bolted on the frame.

Mudrat

[Barry Kaul]

Poison Spyder makes a kit to mount full width axles under a CJ for those of us lacking in fabrication skills. http://www.spydercustoms.com/index2.php

[Mudrat]

Poison Spyder makes a kit to mount full width axles under a CJ for those of us lacking in fabrication skills. http://www.spydercustoms.com/index2.php

Thanks Barry. THIS (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/Dsc00113.jpg) would have saved me some agravation
And I like the looks of these. TOP (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0058.jpg) and SIDE (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0060.jpg) But why is the angle aft so steep? That (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0063.jpg) looks like it's too far??

The only thing I really need is the mounting strap or rear mount. I have LOTS of 1/4 and 3/8 plate. Hummm ... :-| ... maybe just cut some triangular plates drill for the diameter of the bushing and weld it to a 3/8 plate then weld the whole durn thing to the frame???

Mudrat :mrgreen:

[Barry Kaul]

You talking about the shackle angle? It's adjustable. I think I might have to get this setup. Check out the tubular fenders to. :?

[Mudrat]

You talking about the shackle angle? It's adjustable. I think I might have to get this setup. Check out the tubular fenders to. :?
Yeah, I saw the multiple mounting holes - but both mine have the shackle almost 90deg to the frame? I know it's supposed to point a little back, but that just looks too far??
I'm going to see if one of the guys in the shop can cut and bend me some plate like that. I'll mock it up to get the rear hanger in the right spot, drill it then weld it up. But I agree, that's cool loooking setup.

Mudrat :mrgreen:

[Lifted79CJ7]

Hey Mudrat, long time, no talk! Hey, I thought you had seen that kit before, you could pick that up and sell the SRS system you have on ebay to recoup some cost! Anywho, how is the Jeep coming, had a chance to work on it at all? Some new pics would be cool! I have donw absoluetely squat to my engine. Needless to say, I have been tied up with some stuff and trying to get some money back from someone that owes it to me. #-o Anwho, how is the YJ coming as well? Gotten much of a chance to work on it at all?
Later,
Jack

[Mudrat]

Hey Mudrat, long time, no talk! ... Later,
Jack
Well getta your head otta the corporate world ... 8) And, you have my work and home numbers :(:

I've got the rest of the front end parts ready to weld ... maybe getting a TJ this week!! Another project ...

Mudrat :lo1l:

[Mudrat]

$410 and won't fit my front end with the frame plates and I can't just by the front part it's all or nothing. If I could just get the front part in a kit with a 1" longer tube I could weld it myself - but nnoooooooo it's $410 and no discounts.
8) Poison Spider!!!

Back to bodging ....
Mudrat "the dissapointed"



Poison Spyder makes a kit to mount full width axles under a CJ for those of us lacking in fabrication skills. http://www.spydercustoms.com/index2.php

Thanks Barry. THIS (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/Dsc00113.jpg) would have saved me some agravation
And I like the looks of these. TOP (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0058.jpg) and SIDE (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0060.jpg) But why is the angle aft so steep? That (http://www.spydercustoms.com/Axles/imga0063.jpg) looks like it's too far??

The only thing I really need is the mounting strap or rear mount. I have LOTS of 1/4 and 3/8 plate. Hummm ... :-| ... maybe just cut some triangular plates drill for the diameter of the bushing and weld it to a 3/8 plate then weld the whole durn thing to the frame???

Mudrat :mrgreen:

[CJ Shark]

You can see what I built here (http://www.bulltear.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2388&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight) its not as fancy as the blue torch one but it works

[Lifted79CJ7]

That looks awesome CJ!! Great work! You should definitely mass produce that bi-ach and put those other guys outta business! :lo1l:
Jack