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abusedtrucks
05-31-2004, 10:12 PM
I bought a bunch of scout dana 44's. One of the front is setup for a SOA already. I hadn't planned on using it, but I've been considering it lately. I've read through the posts here about the pros and cons about doing SOA. Basically, I want something flexy, but I AM going to drive it on the road, and the smallest tire I'll consider on it is a 36. My bro's jeep is done now, but I don't like how it all sits really. He's got a new 4" skyjacker softride lift, and 1 3/4" shackles with 36x12.50x15's on it. I'd like to put 38's on mine, so here's what I was considering.

Option 1. SOA plus 2.5" skyjacker lift plus 1.5" shackles. I want to make sure that I've got plenty of clearance for the tires.

Option 2. SUA plus 4" suspension plus 1.5" shackles. The tub is in good shape so I'd be willing to do a small body lift too if necessary.

What are your thoughts. I like option 1, because I want it to be big and bad when it's done, but I do want to drive it 70MPH at the same time.

Lifted79CJ7
06-01-2004, 12:04 AM
Go for the SOA. Just make sure that if you are gonna go for at least 38's, my recomendation to move the axle an inch or two forward. I didn't and wish I had. #-o I am running SOA on scout 44's with 4" RE extreme duty leaves. I like it, but there are several things you have to consider.

1: Caster: Scout axles come stock with 0 caster, except for some 1980 model-those are rare.

2: Scout axles come with dana 30 strength outers, so big axles are a lot of strain on big meats.

3: Lift shackles are just a bad idea all the way around in my book. It reduces your caster, which is already bad because of #1. I cut the knuckles off of mine and had to do a lot of work to get my 2,5" springs to work SOA and then added in my necessary caster.

4: Scout axles come with crappy gearing. You're gonna have to regear.

5: You are gonna have to go high steer. No way around it. Add in the cost of finding some 1975 F100 Scout truck dana 44 front axle knuckles and all associated parts with high steer.

6: Hope this made since - I am completely bombed trying to type here! :razz: :razz:

Let me know if you have any questions or if you want me to take some pics for ya!
Jack

abusedtrucks
06-01-2004, 12:10 AM
Thanks a ton for the input. I could just order the 4" lift and not do lift shackles. I already have 4.56's for it, and cheapo lockers. Lockrite for the front and a minispool for the rear.

I'll probably have some questions about the steering and what will actually need to change for that. I'm not sure what I'll do there really.

Mudrat
06-01-2004, 07:04 PM
Thanks a ton for the input. I could just order the 4" lift and not do lift shackles. I already have 4.56's for it, and cheapo lockers. Lockrite for the front and a minispool for the rear.

I'll probably have some questions about the steering and what will actually need to change for that. I'm not sure what I'll do there really.
1. Stay away from extended shackles - you're just asking for problems
2. D44's, 4:56 detroits undera a SOA spring reverse up front and 3" skyjacker: nets a 12"' space from the 35's to the fender in back and almost 20 up front :? 36/37/38"s NO PROBLEM!

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/CJ%20on%20tires.JPG

You can get a 'feel for height here ...
http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/Me-n%20Jeep.JPG

Hi Steer with 1.5" DOM tierods and draglink using 3/4" Heim joints ...
http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/tierod-draglink.JPG

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/hi-steer%20RT%20side.JPG

Mad cow disease http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/image0011.jpg

Mudrat :?:

abusedtrucks
06-01-2004, 09:35 PM
That's pretty sweet. I can't wait to get to MN and start working on it again. I'll get more pics soon, with the other set of Dana 44's in it. I bought a whole bunch of these things, so instead of having to set one up for the SOA, there was already a front that's done for that. Just gotta put gears and a locker in it.

Lifted79CJ7
06-02-2004, 07:12 PM
Just make sure to check your caster and the welds!!

abusedtrucks
06-02-2004, 07:30 PM
Yeah, as I'm doing everything, I'm trying to check and double check as I go. Now is the time to do it right since it's all tore down already.

I'll get some pics once I'm back in MN and let everybody ridicule me for my work. :mrgreen:

78304CJ-7
10-03-2004, 02:31 PM
I am working on 1.5" lift springs SOA with a 1" BL. Those are 37 MTR's. I think a 3" lift spring SOA is alot unless you are going full width. Here are some pics of mine. I Moved the front axle forward 1.5".




http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/Front_View.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/Rear_View.jpg

Getting them under the rig:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/D60_Mounted_1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/D60_Mounted_1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/MTR_SideView.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/rjorgens/RearEnd_1.jpg

Lifted79CJ7
10-03-2004, 10:29 PM
I guess my 4.5" leaves and tiny scout axles aren't a great idea then, either, eh?? :mrgreen: After finishing the suspension, I have now been seriously considering full width one ton axles. Now to just find the $$$ for them!! Hell, I still need to finish my engine!! :razz:
Jack

http://www.alanator.com/projects/jacksjeep/pics/Jeep%20in%20driveway%20with%20tarp.jpg

Mudrat
10-04-2004, 04:57 AM
I am working on 1.5" lift springs SOA with a 1" BL. Those are 37 MTR's. I think a 3" lift spring SOA is alot unless you are going full width. Here are some pics of mine. I Moved the front axle forward 1.5".
It is a bit much and I had an angle difference as in the front was 3" higher than the rear - so I cut it back down. If my original measurements were correct I'm right about 7" over all to the floor board.

I wish AI had as much room in my shop as you do :smile:

Mudrat

78304CJ-7
10-04-2004, 11:27 AM
It may work for you and the type of wheeling you do. I do alot of off camber stuff. I didn't want full width but didn'y want to be too tall either. Just IMO that is really tall for < 60" WMS axles. I guess you could adjust with less Back spacing on your wheels.


-RJ

78304CJ-7
10-04-2004, 11:30 AM
I am working on 1.5" lift springs SOA with a 1" BL. Those are 37 MTR's. I think a 3" lift spring SOA is alot unless you are going full width. Here are some pics of mine. I Moved the front axle forward 1.5".
It is a bit much and I had an angle difference as in the front was 3" higher than the rear - so I cut it back down. If my original measurements were correct I'm right about 7" over all to the floor board.

I wish AI had as much room in my shop as you do :smile:

Mudrat


I see the problem. That is an old body shop that I am borrowing as it hasn't been used in about 10 years. It leaks and is about to be torn down in the spring. I wish I had that much room as well. I don't ecen have a garage at this point :!: . I will hopefulyl have it rolling this weekend under her own power. I am working on the clutch now. After that weld the rear perched and plumb the brakes.

-RJ

tufcj
10-04-2004, 01:39 PM
My CJ with 1.5" lift springs, SOA and shackle reverse, TJ flares. 37" MT/Rs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v475/tufcj/Jeep/sideview2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v475/tufcj/Jeep/SOAfront.jpg

I used a cut down (56") Dana 44HD, 1/2" wall axle tubes. It's fitted with Ford rotors for the stronger stub shafts, internal hubs, and 5 on 5.5" bolt pattern. 35 spline Dana 60-2 semi floater rear coming during the winter.

78304CJ-7
10-04-2004, 02:01 PM
:lo1l: I like it. Very nice setup. From the looks of it you ommited the sway bar. How does it ride without it. Did you move that front forward or does the SR do that on it's own. I would like to see how you mounted your shocks I am looking for some good idea's thanks!

-RJ

Mudrat
10-04-2004, 04:31 PM
I see the problem. That is an old body shop that I am borrowing as it hasn't been used in about 10 years. It leaks and is about to be torn down in the spring. I wish I had that much room as well. I don't ecen have a garage at this point :!: . I will hopefulyl have it rolling this weekend under her own power. I am working on the clutch now. After that weld the rear perched and plumb the brakes.

-RJ
Yeah, I could use another week or two off from work, limit myself to one project Jeep (Daughters YJ is in process too - outside). Finally got her roll bar out (swaping in an 'H' stlye from a 93 YJ) and found the typical body rust I need to cut and replace - on both sides.

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/87%20YJ/Rollbar-3a.JPG

Hey, this is my baby girl so I want to make sure it's RIGHT!!!

And to get the dash back together I need those funcky little cable adjusters . . anybody have a couple they aren't using??

During ...

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/87%20YJ/Dash-2a.JPG

STILL diring - but furhter along ... notice the color change???

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/87%20YJ/Dash-3a.JPG

I've got the Tuffy 'glove box' ready to go in but wanted to get he cables adjusted first :?

Mudrat :?:

tufcj
10-04-2004, 08:20 PM
The upper shock towers are Wagoneer, the lower mount is the Chevy mount (relocated), but I cut the tabs for the bolt off, welded on a flat plate parallel with the axle, drilled a hole and bolted in a shock mount pin. I like the shock pins mounted in a front/rear alignment, that way the shock rotates on the pin when the axle twists, instead of fighting the bushing if mounted side/side.

I used the SRS kit from M.O.R.E (www.mountainoffroad.com), which moves the axle forward about 1.5". It also uses a 2.5" wide front spring instead of the CJs stock 2".

As far as the sway bar, it's been gone since the Jeep was almost new. I get a lot of body lean in corners with the soft suspension, but I drive it like a Jeep, not a sports car. I've driven it on 400+ mile road trips, at 75+ MPH, and it drives straight and true.

It works very well, I can ramp over 1000 on a 20 degree ramp.

Bob.
tufcj

Mudrat
10-06-2004, 11:15 AM
My CJ with 1.5" lift springs, SOA and shackle reverse, TJ flares. 37" MT/Rs.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v475/tufcj/Jeep/SOAfront.jpg

What distance do you have between your axle and the bump stop? Looks like you have more room than I do at 7"??

Mud

tufcj
10-07-2004, 07:59 AM
I measured last nite. I have 7" between the top of the U-bolt plate and the frame. I use factory cast steel Chevy truck plates with the Chevy 5/8" u-bolts. The bumpstop (Rancho) is almost 3 1/2" tall. That gives me about 3 1/2" of un-buffered up travel, and another 1 1/2 - 2" as the bumpstop compresses. I get most of my travel in droop anyway, but the cushy bumpstops prevent any hard bangs, and prolong the life of the springs by preventing too much negative arch.

Bob
tufcj

Mudrat
10-07-2004, 12:04 PM
I measured last nite. I have 7" between the top of the U-bolt plate and the frame. I use factory cast steel Chevy truck plates with the Chevy 5/8" u-bolts. The bumpstop (Rancho) is almost 3 1/2" tall. That gives me about 3 1/2" of un-buffered up travel, and another 1 1/2 - 2" as the bumpstop compresses. I get most of my travel in droop anyway, but the cushy bumpstops prevent any hard bangs, and prolong the life of the springs by preventing too much negative arch.

Bob
tufcjWheeewu #-o I thought I was going to have a problem. Same distance - different stops, I have the 3" poly-blocks on there but they are kinda hard. I was thinking going softer, but will wait and see how it reacts. I fabbed up my spring plates from some 3/8 plate using the 5/8" U-bolts. I put'm in my shop press and bent some curve in them to match the springs :? 20 Tons works wonders :shock:

What brake lines did you use? I replaced all my stock stuff with stainless tubing and have braided lines for the front end. Yeah I know MC - U don't like the braided ones, but I got these before I heard about using the chebby stuff. What I'm finding is that since I bought the lines for a 3" spring under, I'm a bit short in the brake line area.

Mudrat

tufcj
10-07-2004, 01:45 PM
I used braided steel too. I've never had a problem. I've never seen one break unless they are too short and stretched. They're made by a local stock cars shop. The neat thing on mine is that the frame and caliper adapters thread onto the lines themselves. If I break one (never have), I have a couple of spares in the toolbox. Quick and easy to thread off and on, add fluid, bleed, and go.

I have rear discs, so I modified the rear lines to run along the frame, then drop to the calipers like the front. Keeps the line off the rear axle and up out of harm's way. The rear lines are identical to the front, so the same spare piece works there too.

Mudrat
10-07-2004, 06:57 PM
Cool idea!! Did you use the standard axle splitter on the drivers side frame rail (inside or out??) and run a hard line across the rear cross member? Also are the lines your guys make DOT approved? In good 'ole Virginny we have state inspections and they look at that kind of stuff. And I haven't found a shop that can make DOT approved lines - for racers yes, but not for street machines.

'Rat

tufcj
10-07-2004, 08:46 PM
Yep, just a standard "T" in the line on the drivers side, then across the crossmember in front of the tank. I even used brackets pulled from a wagoneer to secure the top of the braided lines, just ran self-tapping bolts into the frame.

No, my lines aren't DOT approved, but I'm pretty confident of the lines this guy makes, he supplies NASCAR and even aerobatic planes with braided hydraulic lines. Luckily, we don't have safety inspections like that out here in Colorado. We also have a rolling 25 year age for "collector vehicle" plates, so last year, I got them (Jeep is a 77). Now I don't even have to do emissions tests any more as long as I keep the tags current. Gotta love old cars.


Bob
tufcj

Lifted79CJ7
10-08-2004, 11:47 AM
I hoping to do the same thing here since my CJ is a 77 also. I gotta look up to see if in VA it is only 25 years or somestates just say before 1975, etc.
Jack
Oh, and Paul, here is my Jeep spung over on R.E. 4inch leaves.
http://www.alanator.com/projects/jacksjeep/pics/Jeep%20in%20driveway%20with%20tarp.jpg

Jessecj7
04-14-2005, 10:49 PM
Thanks a ton for the input. I could just order the 4" lift and not do lift shackles. I already have 4.56's for it, and cheapo lockers. Lockrite for the front and a minispool for the rear.

I'll probably have some questions about the steering and what will actually need to change for that. I'm not sure what I'll do there really.
1. Stay away from extended shackles - you're just asking for problems
2. D44's, 4:56 detroits undera a SOA spring reverse up front and 3" skyjacker: nets a 12"' space from the 35's to the fender in back and almost 20 up front :? 36/37/38"s NO PROBLEM!

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/CJ%20on%20tires.JPG

You can get a 'feel for height here ...
http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/Me-n%20Jeep.JPG

Hi Steer with 1.5" DOM tierods and draglink using 3/4" Heim joints ...
http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/tierod-draglink.JPG

http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/hi-steer%20RT%20side.JPG

Mad cow disease http://members.cox.net/mudrat/posted%20pics/image0011.jpg

Mudrat :?:

do you have any close up pics of how you outboared your springs??

thanks, jesse

Mudrat
05-09-2005, 07:30 PM
I am working on 1.5" lift springs SOA with a 1" BL. Those are 37 MTR's. I think a 3" lift spring SOA is alot unless you are going full width. Here are some pics of mine.
It is. I've got about 63"WMS front, rear and trailer (also spring over :lo1l: )

Mud

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