Ok time to sign up and guess the horsepower on the dyno

[Blown7]

As you all may know or not know my 401 is damn near ready for the dyno. I've scheduled two weeks of dyno time on the weeks of Nov 6 and November 13 of 2006 (about a month away). I have my best guess of what this 4 year project will make for the final numbers, but I was interested on what you guys think this thing will make.
Pertinent info
1976 401 AMC out of a waggy.
Bored .020 over
Decked .010
Block deburred, align bored on Bridgeport
Drilled main bearing oiling holes.
Main bearing stud girdle, 2 bolt mains with arp studs.
Oil valley oil line, (should be good for at least 50 HP right there 8) )
Custom designed Je Pistons 7.75-1 compression, speed pro rings.

Carillo rods, bushed for a .990 pin, oil hole, full float pins with spirol locks.
Crankshaft cross drilled, standard size.
Clevite bearings.
Isky 5300 blower cam, hydraulic lifters.
Rollmaster timing set. Set 4 degrees retarded.
Around .540 lift.
Heads have 2.080 intake, 1.780 valves, 5 angle valve job,valves unshrouded to gasket, ports equally ported to same size using the Bridgeport. Chambers cleaned and re machined using the Bridgeport,polished, 64.4 CC on every chamber. Studs, 7000 RPM springs, 1.6 ratio rockers. Core wires removed. Bronze valve guides with .343 valve stems. Exhaust ports all machine ported.
Intake custom made single plane blower manifold, port matched to heads using the bridgeport.
6-71 GMC blower, toleranced to .005" clearance 3% underdriven, (about 8-10 PSI boost.
Dyers blower drive custom designed by me.
16 100 Lb fuel injectors at the intake to the blower, Fast ECM, BDS Bugcather. Vertex Magneto gutted acting as only as a dizzy with a phasable rotor..but with pressure lubed shaft and bearings.
MSD 6AL Cap box driving a MSD Blaster coil, Crane fireball flying magnet crank pickup. (crank sensor)
Aeromotive 1000 gal per hour fuel pump. -12 (3/4 inch fuel feed line split into two -8 (1/2 inch fuel feed to manifold) -8 return to tank.
Custom by me, 1 7/8 headers. Kit by Headers by ED( I would have rather had 2 inch headers but 2 inch tube is too hard to Siamese on the inside ports.
Stand alone 400 HP shot of Nitrous.
Full accessory drive, Alternator, PS, A/C
Head studs.
Custom by me 12 quart dual pick up Milodon sump.
An lastly ( I'm sure I forget a few other things[old age])
Bulltear timing cover and gears, 534 bypass adapter, -12 (3/4 inch) oil feed lines, duel oil filters.
Crank and all rotating parts balanced like the Nascar guys do, I have been sworn to secrecy on the balancing. ( Seriously) You ever see a used Nascar crank on Ebay? They are destroyed not sold. This balace job would have cost 10 k for anyone else. (Hint bananced in 2 planes)
Mondello steel flywheel, that expensive Aussy vibration dampner.
Alright now post your best guesses,
About the Dyno and the tuner, 20 yrs as Team Jaguar Head mechanic,builds only high end foreign engines, Mercedes, Ferrari, Porsche. Super something Dyno, his right hand man is a young tuner genious kid, complete with earing and funny way he wears his hat.
Kiwi Engineering is the company name located in Old Saybrook Connecticut.
I had to pull alot of favors to get this guy to do the tuning, ( he hates Nitrous) and has a 3 yr backlog. plus he's English.
Oh yea all this on pump gas, race fuel on weekends.
Ok ask questions, flame, or just sit back in wonder.
Jeff

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicAug1006083.jpg

[82Waggy]

4 digits.

[jeepsr4ever]

Moment of truth buddy! :mrgreen:

[Goose]

Im thinking a Gob o power, but what I want to see is the look on your face at WOT with a full shot of nitrous on the Dyno..I bet ya Squeal like a girl and wet yerself!! (Ok I know I would ..)

[BREK]

I'm thinking somewhere in the early 4 digits :t:

[Mudrat]

Just don't run it in the mud!!! And I'm with Brek, low 4 digits ...

[jeep_man_401]

Hey, we have the same color of water pump pulley :t:

I can only guess...but I'm with Goose on the wetting part. :mrgreen:

I ran mine on the dyno and you hear things you don't normaly hear. And then someone else is running the throttle besides. #-o

[Blown7]

Hey, we have the same color of water pump pulley :t:

I can only guess...but I'm with Goose on the wetting part. :mrgreen:

I ran mine on the dyno and you hear things you don't normaly hear. And then someone else is running the throttle besides. #-o

Well the parts are changing color, the pulley is now black just like original that was just yellow Zinc Chromate primer
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506030.jpg
Jeff

[Blown7]

Moment of truth buddy! :mrgreen:
Yea maybe I'll poop my pants with excitement, or cry like a baby if we make 35 grand worth of schrapnel.

Jeff

[Blown7]

BTW this is what 6 grand worth of pistons and connecting rods looks like, not impressive huh? Especially when you never get to see them with the pan on.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506001.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506006.jpg

Jeff

[ironman_gq]

you gonna go to the moon with that thing. i'd say close to 1500

[jeep_man_401]

Maybe you'd like to put that monster in my wood hauler...with some slicks you MIGHT me able to get some traction... :razz:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y116/jeep_man_401/DSC00868.jpg

Then again, it just might flip all the way over #-o

[tarior]

I sure hope you've got enough bottom end to hold all that. I think with that budget I might have sprung for a custom Callies crank (~$2400) and some Pro-Gram main caps.

[Blown7]

I sure hope you've got enough bottom end to hold all that. I think with that budget I might have sprung for a custom Callies crank (~$2400) and some Pro-Gram main caps.

No. Stock crank, studs, and a stud girdle. 111!!!
Why? Can't a stock crank take 100 HP per journal?
Splayd caps breed their own problems.

Jeff

[tarior]

I think you're going to be making quite a bit more than 500 hp.
I personally would be a little afraid of making 1200-1500 hp on the stock bottom end of anything, even a BBC or Hemi.

[1980_Cj7]

Well Jeff, I sure hope you have better luck than we did, partner. (And I thought we had a lot of time and money invested!) We're still waiting to hear something from the machine shop, by the way, that's why we've been quiet lately.

My guess is 1111 HP. You ought to start a pool, and whoever guesses closest wins a prize. What are you putting that monster in? You might have said already, but if you did, I forgot. Can't wait to hear what yours puts out! You ought to make an audio file of it for us too.

I know the feeling, that first startup is scary. You go over a million things in your mind trying to make sure you didn't forget anything.

[rustyfloors]

What are you putting that monster in? You might have said already, but if you did, I forgot.
I think he's planning on putting it in a CJ7! 111!!!

[Blown7]

What are you putting that monster in? You might have said already, but if you did, I forgot.
I think he's planning on putting it in a CJ7! 111!!!

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicjune10021.jpg

Yea baby!! 111!!! X2 Probably the dumbiest thing anybody's ever done
Jeff

[Blown7]

I think you're going to be making quite a bit more than 500 hp.
I personally would be a little afraid of making 1200-1500 hp on the stock bottom end of anything, even a BBC or Hemi.

To be honest me too. I'm not too concerned under 5000 RPM it's that last 1500 RPM and the go fast juice that I'm concerned about. There is a pic or movie from the 1960's or 70's of a Hemi powered car at the drags leaving the line and you can see the crankshaft still attached to whats left of the mains hitting the pavement under the car while it is still turning.

Jeff

[pyagid]

Jeff, are you going to get video of it on the dyno? I would like to try to make it down there when you test it, but I don't think i will be able to get off work

-Paul

[Goose]

Heh Heh.. I want video of the first time he hits the loud pedal..split screen, a close up of his face and a shot of the CJ.. Americas funniest for sure! You do realize you are building the equivalent of all those wild scary fuel alterds right?? I saw a hemi powered cj7 a few years back.. and it was pretty exciting. the guy did this thing, put it in 4wheel and nail it on pavement.. it would jump right over one of those concrete parking blocks..(It would also twist the drive shaft off about every 4 times.)

Still without adventureous souls like you the rest of us wouldn't be able to define the words.. excess...or overkill or may even holySh1TE!!! looka that! Go for it! :!:

[1980_Cj7]

What are you putting that monster in? You might have said already, but if you did, I forgot.
I think he's planning on putting it in a CJ7! 111!!!

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicjune10021.jpg

Yea baby!! 111!!! X2 Probably the dumbiest thing anybody's ever done
Jeff

Well, I think you'll have enuff power to spin those stickers off the tires anyhow, ha, ha.

[Holeshot]

With such big valve overlap, huge carb, open plenum intake, and excessive dynamic compression trying to run on pump gas, I'd be surprised if it idled reliably below 900-1000rpm and would predict that the actual torque curve would be much more narrow and much lower output than indicated at the bottom end. In fact, I would predict that power would be almost unusable below 3000rpm and that it would need a 3500 or higher stall converter if an auto tranny was used. :razz:

Hey Goose...LOVE the new icons!!!

[Blown7]

Jeff, are you going to get video of it on the dyno? I would like to try to make it down there when you test it, but I don't think i will be able to get off work

-Paul

Gonna see if I can borrow or buy one of those CD video cameras. I would like to document alot of the setup and runs. Also to watch the laptop reprogramming so I can do it without having to run down to Kiwi every week till I'm proficient on changing the fuel maps. The whole idea of the ECU is program 1 for DD thru program 4 for Monson Hillclimb. Or Englishtown.

Jeff

[radamx]

I sure hope you've got enough bottom end to hold all that. I think with that budget I might have sprung for a custom Callies crank (~$2400) and some Pro-Gram main caps.

I have a stock reworked crank with cast caps and good rods and mine dynoed at 1162 hp with Nitrous and I run it between 7,000 and 8,000 rpm every pass .
so far no problems....

[Blown7]

Hers a pic of the stud girdle.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1006001.jpg

Jeff

[tarior]

I LIKE the stud girdle, I've been saying forever that that is what the AMC V-8 needs, especially 343-360's. Where did you get yours? One of the other members was talking about having some of these made, but I haven't heard anything about it in some time.

[jeepsr4ever]

At least 50 horse Jeff.....50 at least :mrgreen:

[Goose]

shoot!.. that oughta be worth 75 hp at least..!! :?

[Blown7]

I LIKE the stud girdle, I've been saying forever that that is what the AMC V-8 needs, especially 343-360's. Where did you get yours? One of the other members was talking about having some of these made, but I haven't heard anything about it in some time.


I got it from a Larry Keoman from the AMC Forum. He has some kind of automotive machine shop. I have the addy at the hanger I'll get it today. He charged me 165 dollars because I used my own studs.I was going to make my own but for that price I couldn't even turn my Bridgeport on. You just have to either grind or machine off the cap numbers and the casting flash on the top of the caps. I then took a surface gage and dial indicator off the oil pan attach surface at the block and made sure all the bolt attach areas at the caps where parallel and flat and on the same plane.

Jeff

[Blown7]

At least 50 horse Jeff.....50 at least :mrgreen:
Yea from these here Bulltear valve covers. Gotta love that Bulltear guy!
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1306007.jpg

Jeff

[Blown7]

And it's goofy little things like this that chew up days of time. Had to make my own water outlet and oil filler tube as the blower limits all the space in here.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1306008.jpg


Don't critique my welds, they ain't the prettiest but I gots me lots of penetration and they also pressure check satisfactory so they are good to go. (Wish I had me some of those new fangled CNC millers like that Bulltear guy.

Jeff

[Blown7]

All these wires just control the fuel supply
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1306018.jpg

[Blown7]

And this especially for 82Waggy. Why wouldn't I add the oil valley bypass line? I have over 50 separate external lines why wouldn't I add one internal line? I Love Lines!!!!! :lo1l:
Can't wait for 10 years from now after vibration starts killing all these lines off one by one. But for now it looks real cool.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1306019.jpg

Jeff

[Blown7]

Heres alot of work too the bottom of the magneto, all custom made by me notice another 25 HP with that Bulltear dizzy gear.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506091.jpg

[Blown7]

And on top of it, I still gotta work on these damn planes, I overhauled this engine last year, the 401 costs more than this engine did, and this engine cost 36 grand to do.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1306030.jpg

Jeff

[82Waggy]

:-|

At least you can inspect those, they actually do something, and they are not chaffing on the valley pan. :?

[Blown7]

:-|

At least you can inspect those, they actually do something, and they are not chaffing on the valley pan. :?
Actually the bypass line inspection is "on condition" the condition being no oil pressure :!:
I have cut out that portion of the valley pan.
Jeff

[82Waggy]

:t:

Good morning by the way!

Nice Banana you got there. Yours? One of my favorites, especially the old V35B with at least 285HP.

[Blown7]

:t:

Good morning by the way!

Nice Banana you got there. Yours? One of my favorites, especially the old V35B with at least 285HP.
Good morning back, although it's now 3;08 PM here. No thats a customers plane 1961 N35. This is mine 1976 182P
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicAug1506070.jpg


I'm a big guy and I don't look good getting out of a low wing (kinda like a elephant giving birth)

Jeff

[Blown7]

I LIKE the stud girdle, I've been saying forever that that is what the AMC V-8 needs, especially 343-360's. Where did you get yours? One of the other members was talking about having some of these made, but I haven't heard anything about it in some time.

Got the addy, Finishline Motor and Machine
633 E. Archwood Dr.
Eagle point, OR. 97524
541-973-7449

Jeff

[tarior]

Thanks, I think I'll be needing one for a 360 project.

[BREK]

The suspense is killing me here. Have you been to the dyno yet?

[jeepsr4ever]

932hp

[82Waggy]

Ahh, the workhorse of the sky.

I'm actually a high wing fan myself, designed and manufactured five of them for about 19 years.

As an aviation mechanic you should know that lines like that hidden valley bypass develop leaks all the time!!!!!!!!! :idea:

[Blown7]

The suspense is killing me here. Have you been to the dyno yet?
The week of November 6 th is scheduled for the tuning and runs.

Jeff

[Blown7]

932hp

:t:

[Blown7]

Ahh, the workhorse of the sky.

I'm actually a high wing fan myself, designed and manufactured five of them for about 19 years.

As an aviation mechanic you should know that lines like that hidden valley bypass develop leaks all the time!!!!!!!!! :idea:

Oh yes I do, the way I have it figured that from startup I'll watch the initial pressure then set the engine analyser for a low oil warning.
BTW I'm running a aircraft engine analyser.
You'll appreciate this, I also run one in the Skylane
http://www.buy-ei.com/UBG-16_Bar_Graph_Engine_Analzyer.htm

Jeff

[82Waggy]

:wink:

I don't think it is really going to leak, but you already know why I don't like them.

Good to see a fellow gadget freak out there.

Anxious to see what the blown motor does. I expect it will be fantastic.

[fuzz401]

1075 HP

[radamx]

My guess is 750 plus ? NOS
Be careful over driving that blower with out a crank suport with that pulley that far out there.
Good luck

[Blown7]

My guess is 750 plus ? NOS
Be careful over driving that blower with out a crank suport with that pulley that far out there.
Good luck

Here is the latest pics, fully assembled for hopefulley the last time. Note the blower drive snout, the top pulley is actually installed backward. The snont is Dyers 10.25" long. Usually a AMC uses a 8.25 inch drive with the pulley installed outwards. I wanted the most support on the outer bearing so I reengineered the system so that the blower belt tension is actually behind the outermost bearing.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1606061.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1606060.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1606066.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct1606059.jpg

Jeff


BTW Fuzz if it only makes 1075 HP with N2O I'll be disappointed.

[Mudrat]

OMG!!!
That is SO cool looking!! Lucky airplane 8)

MC we need a F(@&ing HUGH font for things like this (60 point?)!!!! 24 pitch jsut doesn't say enough!! :mrgreen:

[AMX69PHATTY]

Man that does look cool. :t:

Maybe ya outta call the Discovery Channel, Jesse James aint got nothin' on this !

AMC now equals American MONSTER Corproration.

Blown7, it looks like you've raised the bar.

I see in the pics, the absence of the 4 additional head bolts
that can be added along the bottom edge.
May I ask if you considered adding them or not ?

Maybe hire a proffesional photographer to take pictures of that art work.

It's gettin' near Halloween, and the MONSTERS are startin' to come out !

Nice work dude. =D>

[rustyfloors]

Is it going to be air conditioned? :lo1l: :t:

[Blown7]

Yes I considered adding the extra bolts but like the four bolt main bottom end I decided I didn't need them. Time will tell if I was right or wrong. The real stress in this engine is at the bore so it was o ringed. This engine was never desinged as a all out everytime engine, it is also going to be a daily driver too. From what I've been told (as I never have run a blower engine) in a daily driver there will be more power than I may ever use. Maybe 4 times a year it will do sand drag/hillclimbs.

And yes I need my air conditioning,on the Power steering pump side I'll also have a Sandel compressor for airing up.

To say what really drove this project? I'm just a middle age guy with a big Visa credit line going middle age crazy just trying to recapture the days of my youth.

Jeff

[fuzz401]

Amen Brother

[pyagid]

i cant wait for monson :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l:

[BlaSSer]

I love it.. one of the nicest motors I've seen and then a A/C Compressor on it that looks like its staight out of the junk yard.. Gotta love CJ'ers! :lo1l:

[fifesjeep]

819hp w/out nit.
What kind of engine/frame supports etc are you going to use... And do you have an exoskeleton around the engine compartment... for roll-overs etc?... That would be sweet seeing/hearing that F*%#er rumbling down the street only to realize that it's in a fricken CJ... :lo1l: And if you had an Exoskeleton looking like something from the movies... (I forgot that movie with Mel Gibson.. wait, THUNDER DOME?...) Hahahaha yeah man, you'll have the sickest AMC which in my opinion would be posted in almost all of the 4x4 magazines!!! Once it's up and dynoed or even before it's dynoed call around and have some offroad/performance magazine companies at your side when they dyno it and then when it first hits the street/trails/sand/mud etc... I'd love to read a 10 page article on this beast!!!

[pyagid]

bring it down yesterday? :idea:

[Blown7]

Yes I did, Gregg has a Panterra engine on the dyno now that won't rev over 4 grand. After thats squared away mine goes on.
Probably will be loaded in the dyno at the end of next week, then I have got to go down and hook it up ( I have too many tubes for him to figure out, plus I modified alot of wiring.

Jeff

[Mudrat]

Still think between 12 and 1300 on NO2 :wink:
what's the winner of this contest get??? A RIDE!?!?!?!? :t:

[jeepsr4ever]

Jeff you are totally teasing us...ENOUGH!! :mrgreen:

[Blown7]

Still think between 12 and 1300 on NO2 :wink:
what's the winner of this contest get??? A RIDE!?!?!?!? :t:

If thats what the winner wants he/she's got it.

Right now I'm finding out that Nitrous suppliers are few and far in between in New England. My welding gas supplier (ABCO) in Waterford, CT doesn't carry Nitrous "Plus". Only New Bedford Welding supply does, (they are located in New Bedford, MA. about 75 miles away) Seems like I gotta spend another grand or more to buy a "L" or "M" size tank and fill pump. I just wanted a tank but all new supply tanks have a siphon hose so you can't just flip the supply bottle upside down and fill the 10 LB bottles.
I can get all the Nitrous I wanted but pure Nitrous Oxide requires a FDA license. Which I can't get.

Always something.

Jeff

[Mudrat]

... I can get all the Nitrous I wanted but pure Nitrous Oxide requires a FDA license. Which I can't get.

Always something.

Jeff

Bummer :smile:

[radamx]

I still say 750 + Nitrous but that is only if the front of the crank doesn't break off with the pully that far away from the main and no crank support. it is pretty but AMC engines are known for just that thing .So please be careful.

[fifesjeep]

It makes me sad to see a sweet looking AMC motor getting ready to be destroyed by Nitrous... "ALL THROTTLE NO BOTTLE".... That's my vote. I'm still sticking with 819hp (Without Nitrous)

[Patf10]

im thinkin my glass body cj5 will be fun with a 360. that thing is gonna be so much fun. Ive had dreams of a cj with a blower stickin through the hood. But im in college so im havin trouble even affording those dreams :mrgreen:

[Mudrat]

MC, you got these stickers ready yet??? :lo1l:


"ALL THROTTLE NO BOTTLE"....

[radamx]

I like
ALL BOTTLE NO THROTTLE
I spray more Nitrous than most people have HP.
500 hp spray

[Goose]

Nitrous is effective. no doubt about it..(Caution old fart rambling story follows)

When the mustang II came out with the turbo we swiped the 2000 4 banger into the pinto and used one of the early nitrous systems and went hunting camaros..
Funny stuff for about 10 passess then the bottom end would go "SPANG!" and we would go back and grab another short block and do it again..(we didn't know you shouldnt really put the squeeze on it until it was wound up a bit.. we were pounding on it out of the gate..) only time we got spanked was by some smart guy in a purple VW Karmen Ghia had a 2135cc stroker and a bunch of go fast stuff..with n2o he nailed us so bad we went home..

Oh we came back next week with my small block vega..and busted his butt..

[1980_Cj7]

C'mon Jeff! When are we gonna find out who won the guess the horsepower award??? The suspense is killin' us!

[fifesjeep]

I'm guessing that the motor blew-up on the dyno and he's sort of down in spirit.. :t:
But we would sure like to know... Something. 111!!!

[Blown7]

I'm guessing that the motor blew-up on the dyno and he's sort of down in spirit.. :t:
But we would sure like to know... Something. 111!!!

Well nothing to know yet Greg is still setting up the engine in the dyno. AMC's aren't the most common thing in the engine dyno world for a DTS dyno. All the hold downs and mounts have to be hand made plus we have to machine a flywheel adapter to bolt to the crankshaft/flywheel to turn the driveshaft.

Maybe the end of this week or next for the "pulls"

Jeff

[Blown7]

I spent a couple hours down at Gregs shop today so heres some pics of where it's at
The front door
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-15.jpg

The dyno room
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-27.jpg

What has been taking so long making up the drive coupling to drive the shaft

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-31.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-30.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-21.jpg


Found a use for the old engine mounts


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-19.jpg

Now after all is complete the engine moves to the right
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-28.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-26.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-25.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-23.jpg


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-22.jpg

Down this chute which is in front of the control console a big fan on the roof blows a 40 MPH wind down when the test cell is running to get air for cooling

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-24.jpg

What we sit behind while we watch all the pretty parts scatter

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-32.jpg



On a side note the next project Gregs getting going it's a straight eight from a 1937 Mercedes SK something (I'm not familar with it) this engine needs new connecting rods, pistons, valves, springs. This will be a years worth of work and approximately 150,000 dollars in money. No parts are available for it so everything will be custom made the crank will be manufactured in England. The block alone is worth 250,000 dollars. The car from what I'm told is worth 4 millon. ( Makes our little 401's look like paupers). Greg told me this is a "Pebble Beach Car" I didn't want to seem dumb but I have no idea what that means.

I thought I got a pic of it but for some reason the camera didn't get it.


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-18.jpg


This is what he has a contract for on a yearly basis buildin these little Subarus for Jetboats he gets a little over 500HP out of these 4 bangers




Jeff

[Mudrat]

Ok, your off the hook for another week :wink:

But what I want to know is; What in the heck keeps a 4 popper together at 500 HP :shock: Gotta be some massive internals and one hell of a balance job :t:


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicNov-18.jpg


This is what he has a contract for on a yearly basis buildin these little Subarus for Jetboats he gets a little over 500HP out of these 4 bangers

Jeff

[ironman_gq]

i've seen a 4 banger civic with over 500hp and 300ft/lbs of torque. the guy had way too much time and money in it and way more boost than i thought was sane.

[tarior]

Try a turbo'd Mitsubishi or Nissan 4 banger with 1000 hp! 50+ psi boost!

[Blown7]

Did find a pic on the net of the Mercedes 540K that holds the straight eight engine. Apparently there are only 10 units ever made in the world.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/r_8th_middle_east_international_mot.jpg
If you need a new engine for that do you put a ad on Craigslist?
Related link http://www.newswiretoday.com/news/2598/

And it has a Roots Blower to boot!
Bwhaaaa
Jeff

[Goose]

I just heard Clive cussler pop wood out there somewhere.. :shock:

[76-cj7]

Come on man....your killin us here!!!! Wuts the results on that beast? I'm dying to know!! :(:

[fifesjeep]

Now I seriously think he granaded it on the dyno... :lo1l:
But seriously... what's the hold-up?

[Holeshot]

But what I want to know is; What in the heck keeps a 4 popper together at 500 HP Gotta be some massive internals and one hell of a balance job

You should watch Import Drag Racing (IDRC) on ESPN2 some time, those cars would make my 9 second AMX run home with it's tail between it's legs & a case of the squirts!!!

http://www.importdrag.com/
http://www.importdrag.com/2006/images/nextevent.jpg

http://www.nhrasportcompact.com/
http://www.nhrasportcompact.com/images/driver39.jpg

Videos...
http://www.dragracingtv.com/

[Blown7]

Now I seriously think he granaded it on the dyno... :lo1l:
But seriously... what's the hold-up?

Still in the process, the engine is now in position. Now comes the wiring and the fuel plumbing this week. I had to order a Aeromotive 10 micron after the pump fuel filter which should be in this week. Another issue is whether the Vertex mag small diameter cap will be able to interface with the MSD 6AL box and not scatter the spark and crossfire.
Hang in there I am finally understanding that setting up dyno runs aren't the easiest to do.

Jeff

[radamx]

since when do you run a msd box with a mag .

[Holeshot]

Since PhotoShop...... :lo1l:

[Blown7]

since when do you run a msd box with a mag .
Since I gutted the mag and only use it as a dizzy.

Jeff

[Blown7]

If your familiar with a Vertex magneto, you'll notice where the "P" lead would be I cut down a aircraft wiring harness for a Bendix magneto and threaded the weatherproof fitting into the case with the aircraft lead. It then runs up into the Mag cap.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506088.jpg

Jeff

[Dusty]

and the numbers are :idea:

[tarior]

:popcorn:

[Blown7]

and the numbers are :idea:

Not yet,
I'm going down today to deliver the fuel filter, I also think I may have another problem.
I used solid core spark plug wires and I think from having read on MSD's site that the EMI will be a big problem .I don't know about the FAST ECU. So more investigation is in order.

Jeff

[radamx]

you are correct you will get lots of noise from your sensors with solid core wires . and I have heard of people smokeing there MSD from it . the F.A.S.T. unit will not work at high rpm from all the noise.

[fifesjeep]

:roll: :shock: :razz: 111!!! =D> :-| 8)

[Blown7]

UPDATE AS OF DEC. 7

I went down yesterday to bring down the 10 Micron filter and new Ultra 40 Moroso plug wires.
Here's where it's at,
I don't have any control on the speed that Greg works at, In my 47 years I have found that you cannot rush pure genious, anybody that knows MC can tell you that !!!!
(I.E. The Bulltear timing cover)
My engine sure would look better in the test cell with one lol

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706001.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706002.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706003.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706004.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706005.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706006.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706007.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706008.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706009.jpg

And this is from the control console looking thru the window into the test cell
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec706010.jpg

Also learned something new

Once upon a time some wooden boat manufacturer used stock AMC engines as the standard powerplant.

A new customer of Greg's has one of these he wants to restore, and actually wants to keep it AMC powered. It's questionable if the engine can be salvaged as it was a raw water engine.
I was amazed that even among boat owners the AMC engined boats are still desireable.
So for you guys looking for that 390/401 engine you have another whole bunch of AMC devotees that you have to bid against on EBay.

[fifesjeep]

So,.... is there an E.T.A. for these numbers? :razz:

[Goose]

Ummm (Non Boat dude here..) Whats a "Raw Water" engine??

[Blown7]

Ummm (Non Boat dude here..) Whats a "Raw Water" engine??

A raw water engine is a engine that doesn't use a heat exchanger.
There are two ways to cool a boat engine, using a heat exchanger in which the engine coolant is piped thru a exchanger thru one set of tubes and the lake water or sea water is piped thru another, the engine coolant gives up the heat to the lake or seawater. A raw water engine uses the lake or seawater as the coolant which is then dumped overboard.
A raw water engine is subject to all the contamination of the water especially if it is saltwater, instant coolant passage corrosion. Imagine saltwater eating our beloved 401s alive from the inside out.


Jeff

[Blown7]

So,.... is there an E.T.A. for these numbers? :razz:

Well I'm hoping maybe next week,
Greg has a little heartburn with the small diameter Vertex/dizzy cap. He likes the large diameter caps like the GM HEI size with the MSD 6 box. Because of the 20 degree constant firing sequence there is a possiblity of spark scatter to a ajoining tower. Leaving the MSD 6 box out is not a option as it is a instant 20 HP addition. I have a way to fix it and I think it will work satisfactory.
If I wanted absolute dependancy/HP I would have done a few things differenty.
Like a MoTec control, double Lambda, moving 8 fuel injectors to the ports, Big dizzy.
I chose the visual impact instead.
A blower engine should have a Mag, (or what looks like one.)

Jeff

[Goose]

Ahhh I see "Raw water" Bad JU-JU :?:

(wonder why they would use that? Cheaper I guess..)

[Holeshot]

Where are the EGT bungs that we should be seeing on the headers??? How can anybody tune an engine on a dyno without an EGT reading for each cylinder???

[Holeshot]

Here's what the boat exhausts look like when installed backwards to be used as liquid-cooled twin-turbo exhaust manifolds...

http://home.comcast.net/~dhoelcher/amc/tech/eng/boat-ex_3.jpg

I'd bet that there is a liquid-cooled motocrosser head gasket that would fit the output flange.
As is, these manifolds have a hose in & a hose out, so all I need is a couple of heater cores with small fans to cool the exhaust.

[Blown7]

Where are the EGT bungs that we should be seeing on the headers??? How can anybody tune an engine on a dyno without an EGT reading for each cylinder???

Gregs got to weld some bungs in yet, although I'm researching if the EGT probes I use in my aircraft engines will work. They only require a .156 hole and are held in with a radiator clamp.
They are a type "K" probe.
http://www.alcorinc.com/products/thermocouples/index.htm

I'm really not fond of having to cut a bung out and reweld the header tubes after the run.


Jeff

[Holeshot]

Why not leave the bungs in & plug them with a pipe plug? The ones I got from Summit weld on then you remove the plug & run a next-size-smaller drill bit thru the hole & thru the header. Just install the plugs after the dyno time. Then the EGT ports will still be available if you ever get an onboard data monitoring solution. Thay are getting cheaper all the time. I'm about to start programming my own setup (VS C++) & use an el-cheapo laptop pc to install above the driveshaft tunnel.

[Holeshot]

Another thought: When I was working at a Yamaha dealership back in the 80s, Yamaha sold a "riv-nut" type bung to install in exhaust headers for their EGA machine to attach to. As I recall, it was about a 7mm hole to drill & use their crimping pliers to crimp the bung into the pipe. Then there was a 6mm bolt you could remove from the bung to stick the EGA port adapter into. No weldin, no leaking, though I would use some type of high-temp sealant when installing in a high HP AM engine.

[Mudrat]

Lets change the title of this thread to "When" will the engine get dyno'd 8)

[Dusty]

Lets change the title of this thread to "When" will the engine get dyno'd 8)


Whens Pat going to get the 360 going and in the jeep..... and then if i missed my motor mounts getting some use whens he going to dyno it? 8)

:roll:

[Blown7]

Lets change the title of this thread to "When" will the engine get dyno'd 8)

Talked to Greg yesterday, he had to get some other info about the injector system and the Fast driving the injectors I had to Call craig at BDS so bottom line for right now...
Saturday we turn the key!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stay tuned.........


Jeff

[Blown7]

As a side note after I chatted with Greg and Craig Railsbeck at BDS I got to thinking about when this whole project started. I looked back at my notes and I had dragged the donor Wagoneer home on April 28, 2003 to start removing the running gear. It's been 3 1/2 years seems like a eternity.

Actually I think the easy part was picking the cam, making all the calculations for piston to head, machining all the block and heads, etc...

As a side note I know alot of folks are really anxious I am too.
What I am doing here is taking a mid 1970's engine and controlling it with state of the art technology. I myself haven't seen a 401 this highly modified, run by electrons. Has anyone else?

I'm just a analog guy living in a digital world.

Jeff

[radamx]

the engine in my 69 is a complete efi system .
it has coil on plug ign. a crank wheel and a cam sensor . a 2 bar map sensor and air, fuel pressure ,water temp , nitrous pressure , egts, and dual 02's . the computer controls the trany break ,fuel pump ,water pump,and the nitrous .But I still hit the gas and shift the trany because it was starting to get boreing raceing when all I had to do was point the thing
:razz: :razz: :razz: :razz: :razz:

[Mudrat]

Whens Pat going to get the 360 going and in the jeep..... and then if i missed my motor mounts getting some use whens he going to dyno it? 8)
:roll:

Guess I should have made a bigger splash??? 111!!!

oct 28th ...
After FINALLY getting a chance to spend some time with MY Jeep for a change, the Heart of the Beast kicked over today - several times :wink:

Damn I love it when a plan finally comes together!!! Straight pipes, no muffler, the Heart throbbed and I vibrated :t: Had a woody and damn near had a religious experiance :!:

When I can finally drive it out of the shop, I may have a cardiac!! =D>

Pat I just called..!! Congrats on adding 110 more cubes and 2 more cylinders!!
SOUNDED AWESOME..!!!

The first call was like a comedy routine though :?:

I heard it too :t: :t:

Working on redoing the whole thread (http://www.bulltear.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5846).:t: #-o Actually I found it and bumped it for ya Dusty :idea:

[Blown7]

the engine in my 69 is a complete efi system .
it has coil on plug ign. a crank wheel and a cam sensor . a 2 bar map sensor and air, fuel pressure ,water temp , nitrous pressure , egts, and dual 02's . the computer controls the trany break ,fuel pump ,water pump,and the nitrous .But I still hit the gas and shift the trany because it was starting to get boreing raceing when all I had to do was point the thing
:razz: :razz: :razz: :razz: :razz:

What is the brand of the ECU?

Jeff

[Dusty]

You would have thought i would have seen that one but then again your supposed to be better at keeping us all informed. howcome the thread died so soon. jeesh this ones at 10 pages a 360 build / swap should have at least grabbed 4 pages

[Mudrat]

You would have thought i would have seen that one but then again your supposed to be better at keeping us all informed. howcome the thread died so soon. jeesh this ones at 10 pages a 360 build / swap should have at least grabbed 4 pages
Ummm ... you were busy??? :?:

[Dusty]

You would have thought i would have seen that one but then again your supposed to be better at keeping us all informed. howcome the thread died so soon. jeesh this ones at 10 pages a 360 build / swap should have at least grabbed 4 pages
Ummm ... you were busy??? :?:


Man you aint kidding ive been swamped all year i'll be glad when 08 is here :idea: maybe then i'll get a little breather

[Holeshot]

i'll be glad when 08 is here

08????

[Dusty]

welll im sure as heck not going to get a break in the next 13 months :(:

[radamx]

I am useing the AEM ECU
http://www.aempower.com/ViewCategory.aspx?CategoryID=63
I had a fast unit but I sold it for this one.much better then the old fast unit.I played with a Fast xfi unit a little on the dyno with a sb chevy it was better but I like the AEM for the data logging and the ease of tuning .I am spraying 400 hp nitrous dry with this system and the car runs like a bracket car.


the engine in my 69 is a complete efi system .
it has coil on plug ign. a crank wheel and a cam sensor . a 2 bar map sensor and air, fuel pressure ,water temp , nitrous pressure , egts, and dual 02's . the computer controls the trany break ,fuel pump ,water pump,and the nitrous .But I still hit the gas and shift the trany because it was starting to get boreing raceing when all I had to do was point the thing
:razz: :razz: :razz: :razz: :razz:

What is the brand of the ECU?

Jeff

[1980_Cj7]

Lets change the title of this thread to "When" will the engine get dyno'd 8)

Talked to Greg yesterday, he had to get some other info about the injector system and the Fast driving the injectors I had to Call craig at BDS so bottom line for right now...
Saturday we turn the key!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stay tuned.........


Jeff

Anybody else notice that Jeff didn't say WHICH Saturday???

I think this is getting to be like that sign I saw once that said "FREE GAS TOMORROW", ha, ha.:mrgreen:

[BREK]

I can't take it anymore! I think I'm going home and having a few :razz: :razz: :razz:

[Blown7]

Lets change the title of this thread to "When" will the engine get dyno'd 8)

Talked to Greg yesterday, he had to get some other info about the injector system and the Fast driving the injectors I had to Call craig at BDS so bottom line for right now...
Saturday we turn the key!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stay tuned.........


Jeff

Anybody else notice that Jeff didn't say WHICH Saturday???

I think this is getting to be like that sign I saw once that said "FREE GAS TOMORROW", ha, ha.:mrgreen:


Saturday December 16, 2006
:lo1l:


Jeff

[Mudrat]

I can't take it anymore! I think I'm going home and having a few :razz: :razz: :razz:
I'm doing that now, another 11 hour workday with a 3 hour commute :roll:

[fifesjeep]

Sounds like a long day... 11hr workday 3hr drive... I'll pass! and drink one for ya :razz:

[1980_Cj7]

Saturday December 16, 2006
:lo1l:


Jeff

Anybody think Jeff is gonna sleep tonite??? I know I wouldn't be able to, ha, ha.

Good luck tomorrow Jeff. Can't wait to hear how you make out.

[Blown7]

Thank you


Jeff

[Dusty]

:? :? :? :? :? :? :razz: :razz: :razz: :razz: :razz: :? :? :? :? :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l: :lo1l: :idea:

[fifesjeep]

Who's wanting to bet on something will delay an actual full-pull on the dyno? 8) Just teasing ya man!!! I can't wait for this F*CK*R (The motor) to make some noise... DUDE YOU SERIOUSLY NEED TO HAVE A DIGITAL RECORDER OR SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN DOWNLOAD THE ACTUAL DYNO PULL ONTO THE COMPUTER FOR US!!!
We at-least deserve that for waiting on these soon to be mystical numbers... I'm like a like 5 year old on Christmas Eve waiting for Santa to arrive...
Are we getting presents or are we going to get coal?

[Mudrat]

Saturday December 16, 2006
:lo1l:
Jeff
Anybody think Jeff is gonna sleep tonite??? I know I wouldn't be able to, ha, ha.

Good luck tomorrow Jeff. Can't wait to hear how you make out.
Well post it up - I'll be at work at 0700 both Sat and Sunday this weekend :smile: I hate this frigg'n shipyard that has delayed me and my test team amost a month and making us work weekends AND New Years Weekend 8)

[Mudrat]

We at-least deserve that for waiting for the numbers... like 5 year olds on Christmas Eve waiting for Santa or to open their presents.
I can't wait for Christmas so Mrs Santa opens her robe for Santa!!!! :oops: :? :t:

[fifesjeep]

We at-least deserve that for waiting for the numbers... like 5 year olds on Christmas Eve waiting for Santa or to open their presents.
I can't wait for Christmas so Mrs Santa opens her robe for Santa!!!! :oops: :? :t:

NICE! VERY NICE!!!! :lo1l: :!:
Are they authorizing overtime for you guys or did they Can"x" that.

[Mudrat]

NICE! VERY NICE!!!! :lo1l: :!:
Are they authorizing overtime for you guys or did they Can"x" that.
My guys get OT, I don't. "They" said I'd get compensated for the "other time" I'll lose (about 100 hours) in a bonus check, but if that's the case, I'm only getting $10 an hour - it's bullshit and since my boss is on vacation I left a nastygram in his e-mail box :(:

[fifesjeep]

Well, it's definitely the 16th here in Va and it's Saturday... it's 11:04am... No numbers yet... hahaha Once again like a 5 year old waiting to open his/her presents.. 111!!!

[1980_Cj7]

Well, it's definitely the 16th here in Va and it's Saturday... it's 11:04am... No numbers yet... hahaha Once again like a 5 year old waiting to open his/her presents.. 111!!!

Now it's 4:04 PM here in PA. I've looked here at least 4 times today...still nothing. I feel like an expectant father, or at least an uncle, since Jeff is the Daddy. Is he gonna pass out cigars???

[fifesjeep]

OMG... Where are the numbers? :-| I think after further inspection :idea: We'll find out that... Uh ohhh, something went wrong #-o .... :bazooka: :rightfighter5:

[Holeshot]

'bout like trying to use this picture for whacking material!!!
http://home.comcast.net/~dhoelcher/image/fam/dixie.gif

:bazooka::sign12:

[Mudrat]

Holeshot, your a sick man ... You need a shot of horse power and a good 8 second run to regain your sanity!! 111!!!

Or a lot of :razz:

[fifesjeep]

'bout like trying to use this picture for whacking material!!!
http://home.comcast.net/~dhoelcher/image/fam/dixie.gif

:bazooka::sign12:

That is AWESOME!!!! hahahaha

[fifesjeep]

I don't think it's possible for me to count the times I've checked this thread today... it's still the December 16th, Saturday 11:44pm in Va... Come on dude, what's the hold-up bub... :razz:

[Blown7]

I don't think it's possible for me to count the times I've checked this thread today... it's still the December 16th, Saturday 11:44pm in Va... Come on dude, what's the hold-up bub... :razz:

just got home, eating leftover pizza in my left hand yping with the right
quick numbers as my head hurts with all i learned today
693 hp at 5100 rpm
mid/high 5's in torque from 1900 rpm to 705 at about4000 rpm

edit more to do not running at peak yet
More edit oil pressure stays at around 50 lbs from off idle to the end but idel keeps slipping down a couple pounds every run idle at last pull was 27 lbs with 230 degrees oil temp.

Edit again I got 13 minutes of video, hey the food must be kicking in.
jeff

[jeep_man_401]

693 hp at 5100 rpm
mid/high 5's in torque from 1900 rpm to 705 at about4000 rpm

:-| I'm guessing that is without the NOS??

Do you have a graph that you can post?

What was the cam spec. you installed? PSI Boost?

Those are some pretty respectable numbers for a daily driver, with A/C as I saw on one of you pics.

But...I am going to say alot of people were going to expect more. But everybody has to keep in mind the purpose of the engine a person is building.

I was guessing around or over 1000hp without NOS...but that would be I think barely streetable.

Man you see a motor like that and you wet your pants just looking at it.

Now I have a motor that has 460 torque from 1200 to 5500RPM..let me tell you that is fun! :lo1l: Add another 200 to 300 more and you're going to crap your pants and in a CJ to boot! :t:

I hope you have the drivetrain up to par because you're going to shell anything AMC made themsevles. :oops:

Dana 60's and NP205 min.

Good luck keeping you drivers license :lo1l: :mrgreen:

On a side note...about the oil pressure...I am going to say you're using Regular oil. Now that it's broke in, dump a can of cam break in lube from crane and fill the sucker with FULL syn. and you WILL see a pressure increase at idle and also a increase in HP. I have done this with several AMC motors.

If you don't go Full Syn. then go semi syn. and you should see some increase in pressure.

You need the cam break-in oil with the Syn. because the Syn. dosen't have the zinc that Regular oil does.

[Blown7]

Ok after 5 hours sleep and a hour of uploading pics here's where I'm at...........
Yes those number where without Nitrous, I couldn't find anyone to fill my tank within a couple days. I should have started sooner but I didn't think it would be so hard to do in my area.
Anyhow those numbers were with pump gas, 91 octane
I really learned alot Saturday, so much so that those numbers were quite good.
Yep it's a street engine never wanted it to be anything else.
This engine was built for the purpose of a dependable daily driver, with years of abuse and beating to come, being able to run on 87 octane if need be. ( Although not to be beatin on)
Now anyone that truly knows what it takes to do that should be impressed with those numbers, and I really know now what it takes to get down that low running crappy gas.


Conversly, if I installed aftermarket heads flowed, ported and polished, ran 100 LL or racing fuel, increased boost to 15-18 PSI, and stepped headers this engine would have made, I was told between 800 to 1000 HP without Nitrous never touching the bottom end of the block.


But those number have serious drawbacks, it would never be streetable, it would have to be trailered, it could be a nuclear bomb at anytime.


People focus too much on raw horsepower.
People see a blower and think "God it has to be 1000 HP at least at 8000 RPM"

This engine was built to eat a naturally aspirated Chebby BBC 572 for breakfast,
A Viper for lunch,
and a new Vette for supper.
(all under 100 MPH straight line)

I think it does well for a 30 year old engine revamped running pump gas..
under 5000 RPM.
Add a 400 HP shot of N2O, 100 LL and the numbers are over 1000 HP.
(although I don't think the cam, 30 yr old heads and 2" headers can get the air out fast enough)

And as the days go by I'll give my thoughs/opinions and the engine gurus about how I would do this all differently next time if I was to use the factory block.
Enough talk he's the pics.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506001.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506002.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506003.jpg


This one of the first problems of many that plagued us from the start, I guess I shouldn't have learned to weld aluminum at the manifold installing this boss for the water outlet at the left side of the block I had a crack and inclusisions in the weld area arounf the boss, the guys showed me how to fix it with a hammer, pin punch, green locktite, red locktite, alcohol, and a hair dryer and yea it works!!!
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506004.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506005.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506006.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506007.jpg


Here is the blower removed from the manifold after a backfire and the blower back pressure plate didn't open fast enough.
It blew the base gasket clean out the back, note to self and others throw the damn gaskets in the trash and use Silicone RTV around the hole and the next time the blower has to come off use a 2X4 and a hammer.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506008.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506009.jpg

This is one of my best friends, customer and the guy that got me started on thinking about blower engines Glenn Davis, he built a 392 Hemi in a 1964 Valient at the tender age of 17 to drag race at the old Connecticut Dragway using just Smoky Yannicks old books, talking to Mert Littlefield, and just generally being a engine nerd. BTW he ran 10.1's in the quarter at 18 yrs old. He owns a jet engine component balancing company here in Connecticut and he's the one that did all the engine balancing on this project and introduced me to Greg Hunt at Kiwi Engineering.


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506010.jpg

Notice the pretty header paint turning to charred carbon in this pic.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506012.jpg
Here is Greg Hunt on the right, and Bob on the left these guys give meaning to engine tuning.

These guys are like greased lighting working together at the dyno console. Greg runs the dyno, monitoring the gages, moving the levers, looking out the window, screeming orders while no can hear, and Bob is programming the ECU as fast as he can point, click, type, all the while as the engine is accelerating as it can from idle to 5000 RPM, all the while as the dyno is loading the engine. BTW Bob can type 100 words a minute)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506013.jpg


How we fixed the blower gasket problem
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506014.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506015.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicDec1506016.jpg

[82Waggy]

Hey, my guess was four digits output based upon nitrous. I claim victory!!! :!:


Nice job. Do you plan on changing anything before installing in the CJ?

PS: With those numbers and a little tweeking yet to come, I would not even bother with the nitrous if it was mine.

I think your jeep is going to be a good candidate for one of those Rat Fink Hot Rod cartoons!

[Blown7]

God that took a long time to post.....
Now that I didn't loose all the pics and captions some of the other things that went wrong.

The ECU didn't acknowledge the Crane Fireball hall effect crank sensor.
so good thing I had two backup crank sensor modes, the Magnetic pick up from the flying magnet, Accel dual sync dizzy.

Ended up using the flying magnet MSD setup.

Lost three 1/4" socket head cap screws (out of four) from the flying magnet wheel during a three session pull (would have been catastrophic failure)

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c96/Blown7/newpicOct506093.jpg
I will weld that puppy to the v belt pulley I didn't need all the adjustablity.


The FAST ECU wasn't initally programed to start this monster as Craig Railsbeck and the FAST techs told me even to get it running at idle. The guys at KIWI had all they could do to get inital cells that would ignite this hunk of iron.

Hence all the fire/flame ear splitting pops at inital engine fireup.


The oiling mod for the Vertex dizzy/magneto worked too good, I didn't allow enough depth on the spirol on the shaft to allow enough oil flow down the dizzy shaft thru the bushings.
The oil drained out the bottom of the housing filling the cavity in the timing cover between the block with enough oil in one minute to overflow onto the vibration dampner. Even though it was fed with only a 1/16" inch copper line crimped in three places. Ended up removing the line at the right side block and plugging with a 1/8" pipe plug.

Water leaks at the end bolts at the manifold.
I will remove the manifold back at the hanger, fix the rear water outlet boss (and pressure check next time)

Remove and trash the stupidd intake maniflod valley gasket ( I will never use another one again in my lifetime)


And fix the manifold.

Reinstall the manifold with those good gaskets.

Never use a FAST engine controller again. It's simple enough for the average guys but not enough rows/columns for data.
Motec only.

Headers DO MATTER!!!!

Ok enough for now I'm tired.


Jeff

[Blown7]

Hey, my guess was four digits output based upon nitrous. I claim victory!!! :!:


Nice job. Do you plan on changing anything before installing in the CJ?

[b]The biggest one is, to wait for MC to finish the new timing cover I want to own the first production one, can't wait to throw the new Crown one I bought from him in the trash. Thw water pump pulley belts kept slipping, not allowing the temperature to stay constant in the engine. Strip whats left of the paint off the headers, have them Jet Coated. (all I can think of for now other than posted above)[b]

PS: With those numbers and a little tweeking yet to come, I would not even bother with the nitrous if it was mine.
[b]I am feeling that way myself[b]

I think your jeep is going to be a good candidate for one of those Rat Fink Hot Rod cartoons!

[Goose]

Nicely done.. and I for one am impressed.. I know for a fact that real live numbers like that are damn tough to come by.. It seems that 1000 hp engines are every where except on dyno's..
:wink: :!: Well done and I want video of the first ride..(No I am not crazy enough to be in a real world 700 hp CJ..) but have fun! :lo1l: :sa:

[Blown7]

Vids will be posted here I got one uploaded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3rbs8xXOcs

Jeff

[jeepsr4ever]

no fair Jeff thats some serious teasing! :?:

[1980_Cj7]

After watching that video...I think you should substitute "battery" for "boat" in that famous line from Jaws:

"I think you're gonna need a bigger boat!"

[Mudrat]

Ok enough for now I'm tired.
Jeff
And rightly so!!! Good job :t: You going to dyno tune it or leave it at this?

And my 1200 number was based on NO2 and since I already have the cartoon Avatar - I claim victory :wink:

And after rolling 2 or 3 Jeeps (one was an end-over-end) and a Land Cruiser sideways, I'd still take a ride with ya 111!!!

[jeepsr4ever]

:t: :!:

[fifesjeep]

I claimed 819hp w/out the NO..... I'm thinking if he did run the higher gas etc etc.. My number would've been pretty darn close...
Good deal man!!! very sweet. Now we need a video clip of this beast coming alive and taking off for a red-eye flight!!! =D>

[Blown7]

All right after a good nites sleep after having to do family things yesterday, and chatting with Glenn these are some of the things we had a chance to discuss.
First I myself was figuring that the HP numbers would have been slightly higher. But after some thought about the discussions that I had with Richard Iskidiarian (the cam manufacturer) a couple years ago he did say the cam would fall off rapidly after the rated RPM, that it did.
My though process was if you can easily make 1 HP per cubic inch normally aspirated, 2 HP per cubic inch is easily gained with supercharging, well yes and no. I could have easily done that with a bigger roller cam and yes, Isky Grinds them.
Or I could have increased the drive speed on the blower for higher boost but that would have eliminated pump gas.

Greg stated, ( and gave a disertation) Glenn concurred and now I agree with them that the biggest and easiest way to bring this engine to 800 HP or any AMC engine (you ready for this guys???)



Our beloved, long adored, highly overated, things we would defend to all SBC lovers those things we look for by part numbers in all the used parts columns,


Our CAST IRON DOG LEG HEADS............................

Simply suck. :smile:
At least in a blower engine.

I know sacriledge but true the dyno doesn't lie. These engine guys know what their doing.

Will I run out and buy new Edelbrocks or Indy's?
No remember I'm a purest I grew up with these heads, but the gurus know best. Greg stated this engine with no other changes except with good flowing Aluminum heads would possibly make 200 HP more.
People search for horsepower sometimes spending hundreds of thousands of dollars for 10 HP more.
So for a couple thousand to make 200 HP more???
The best money ever spent.

Ok I gave my opinion and the opinion of others.
so now when someone asks on this board and others whats the first thing to do to bring my 401 to the most HP?
The most bang for the buck?
I'll have to say honestly sell the cast iron heads and buy aluminum aftermarket heads.


What say you all????


Jeff

[Blown7]

Ok enough for now I'm tired.
Jeff
And rightly so!!! Good job :t: You going to dyno tune it or leave it at this?

Well Gregs gonna play with it a little today making sure the closed loop Lambda system works.
But for all practical purposes it's done doing all it will for now.
Again something new I learned is that the dyno sets the inital settings of the engine tuning, the final tuning will be in chassis tuning for driveability. so that will mean after all is said and done he'll come up to the airport and we'll tune the CJ running down the runway for best settingsto the drivetrain (tranny and axle/tire).

Jeff

[1980_Cj7]

Aren't you going to try the nitrous while it still on the dyno, especially after all that work to get it set up on the dyno?

[Holeshot]

I'll have to say honestly sell the cast iron heads and buy aluminum aftermarket heads.


Fully ported Indy SR-1s, big bang-for-buck on your blower motor, Edelbrock, much less bang-for-buck with their small valves.

On a naturally aspirated engine, fully ported & prepped (Advanced Airflow or Indy, for instance) 2.08/1.74 iron heads are great factory heads up to .450"~.500" lift, where the Indy heads really get going. So the $1,500 plus $1,000 for porting is not money well spent by someone that could be satisfied with 550 HP, or 900 HP with NOS. Enough HP for a 10 second street machine, before using the NOS, not too bad.

I don't know how anyone could really expect 40 year-old design factory heads to be AS good as the SR-1s.

The Performers are a good match for the Performer cam & intake, low-end & mid-range Jeep stuff. Not designed for high RPM. Forget about the AFB & AVS carbs, they are from the discarded Carter 40+ year-old designs.

My opinion.

[jeepsr4ever]

X2

[82Waggy]

Depends on what you mean by "as good".

A basic rule of thumb is that a normally aspirated engine could be expected to make about 2HP/cfm of intake port flow - maybe more if everything else is there to support that kind of power output.

Ported stock heads have been known to flow enough to make some impressive high RPM HP - normally aspirated. It also appears to me that stock heads can be made competitive with Edelbrock's stock flow numbers. How far Edelbrock heads can be "opened up" is not known to me.

It may not be "as good" to use a set of Indy Race heads or even their SR-1's if what you are trying to do is make high torque at the lower RPM ranges.

I'm sure Blown7 could get more HP at a higher RPM with just a cam change.

PS: Would love to see the actual Dyno sheet!

[radamx]

I was close but I over guessed mine by a little bit too
Glad all went well .Hope you are going to to pull the pan and check it all out .

My guess is 750 plus ? NOS
Be careful over driving that blower with out a crank suport with that pulley that far out there.
Good luck

[Blown7]

I was close but I over guessed mine by a little bit too
Glad all went well .Hope you are going to to pull the pan and check it all out .

My guess is 750 plus ? NOS
Be careful over driving that blower with out a crank suport with that pulley that far out there.
Good luck


Goning to pull the pan, manifold,(gotta fix that crack #-o ) and one head just to have a look.

Regarding the heads, well yea I'm gonna keep em for a few years. Too much time, my own work in them ( and money)
Even the Edelbrock heads would be a better choice IMHO and can you put bigger valves in them?
I know there is some info on the AMC forums but I get bored reading all those damn numbers.


Jeff

[Blown7]

Depends on what you mean by "as good".

A basic rule of thumb is that a normally aspirated engine could be expected to make about 2HP/cfm of intake port flow - maybe more if everything else is there to support that kind of power output.

Well in this case the Gurus feel the intake side isn't as much the problem, as the "beloved Dog Leg exhaust ports" resticting the exhaust flow out thereby restricting scavenging and intake flow during valve overlap.
Basically in my case if I had spent even 1500 dollars more on good new aluminum heads (with better quench area and detonation carastics) beyond the 1500 I spent in materials and time on the old heads I would have made 200 HORSEPOWER MORE without changing ANYTHING ELSE, or so I was told. A pretty good bang for the buck considering I spent about a 1500 dollars reworking the old heads

My thinking is for 7 dollars per horsepower it's a damn good deal! (1500 dollars/200 HP = 7 dollars per HP)
If someone told you "I can make your engine make 200 HP more for 1500 dollars" I think you'd be first in line to sign up, I would have if I'd know in hindsight.

MY BIGGEST REGRET ON THIS BUILD WAS BEING A PURIST AND NOT BUYING NEW HEADS.

Ported stock heads have been known to flow enough to make some impressive high RPM HP - normally aspirated. It also appears to me that stock heads can be made competitive with Edelbrock's stock flow numbers. How far Edelbrock heads can be "opened up" is not known to me.

What is for the record the highest documented horsepower on a naturally aspirated, not poked and stroked 401 on pump gas?
I know Ken Parkman got around 600 HP on POH challenge.

It may not be "as good" to use a set of Indy Race heads or even their SR-1's if what you are trying to do is make high torque at the lower RPM ranges.

Good heads in my opinion after all this are still the way I'd recommend someone to go, even if you have to sell the project you can almost get your money back on them. Saw a Eldebrock set on Ebay sell for 1300 dollars and brand new what are they?
1500 dollars?

I'm sure Blown7 could get more HP at a higher RPM with just a cam change.

Yes abosolffffffffffffutly!!!
However the next size cams up that I could choose is are fullrollers with high valve spring pressures and with very bad street manners down low. From all I researched this setup is about all anyones going to get from a full blown 8 PSI boost 401 cu in engine that is still streetable. On pump gas.
( hope someday someone proves me wrong, then I'll steal their ideas :lo1l: )

PS: Would love to see the actual Dyno sheet!
Will do when I go back down to KIWI


Jeff

[Blown7]

I'll have to say honestly sell the cast iron heads and buy aluminum aftermarket heads.


Fully ported Indy SR-1s, big bang-for-buck on your blower motor, Edelbrock, much less bang-for-buck with their small valves.

On a naturally aspirated engine, fully ported & prepped (Advanced Airflow or Indy, for instance) 2.08/1.74 iron heads are great factory heads up to .450"~.500" lift, where the Indy heads really get going. So the $1,500 plus $1,000 for porting is not money well spent by someone that could be satisfied with 550 HP, or 900 HP with NOS. Enough HP for a 10 second street machine, before using the NOS, not too bad.

NOPE DON'T AGREE.
Because if your heads are in an as removed condition, you then buy new bigger valves, clearence the combustion chamber bronze guide the heads, add a five angle valve job, mill the block mating surface,clean, remove the core wires, and pressure check,
CC the combustion chambers and port, polish and flow, your half way there to brandy new heads.
I use the half price cutoff to determine if new is worth it.

I don't know how anyone could really expect 40 year-old design factory heads to be AS good as the SR-1s.

At the time I started building this engine Bulltear and AMC forums were not known to me and I figured I had the old AMC performance book I bought new in 1974 and figured that was still the bible of AMC. Later on well the purist in me figured "what the hell the heads are all completed now gonna run em" ( see my join date) lol
The Performers are a good match for the Performer cam & intake, low-end & mid-range Jeep stuff. Not designed for high RPM. Forget about the AFB & AVS carbs, they are from the discarded Carter 40+ year-old designs.

My opinion.

[Holeshot]

Edelbrock tech told me that you may be able to increase their intake valve size a little, but no increasing the exhaust size - so right there you are stuck.



Hello Dave, good day to you.
Thank you for your interest in our Edelbrock Performer and Performer RPM heads for AMC.
We currently offer two part# for this head depending on if you need them with an exhaust crossover port or not.
Both of these heads use a 54cc dual-quench combustion chamber that will produce around a 9.5:1 compression ration on a 401 AMC with stock style pistons.
Unfortunately we currently do not offer any porting services for these heads. If you would like to get these ported I would recommend you talk to Ron Sharp at Advanced Airflow Engineering in Clinton Township, MI phone # 810-294-7915.
Sorry but at the moment we only have flow numbers in our catalog and on our web site for as cast out of the box heads.
Get back to me if you would like to see our flow numbers compared to the Indy 401-SR heads out of the box or the flow numbers for the Indy 401-SR modified and ported.
The largest recommended valve sizes for our heads are up to 2.100" on the intake and up to 1.625" on exhaust.
But we currently do not offer an option for the larger valves sizes.
We know what the Indy heads have and flow stock or modified.
If you are trying to decide between the Edelbrock or Indy heads keep in mind that we use a decent 2.02"intake valve and a 1.60" exhaust valve and that bigger is not always better. Our untouched 60119 heads flow 260 on the intake side and 190 on the exhaust side at .600" lift. Our heads also have an improved oil return circuit and oil passages which all stock AMC 401 suffer from. We have also lowered the height of bolts for the oil drain back holes with intersecting bolt holes.
We have also modified the intake port to produce more cylinder swirl and have improved the short turn radius and an open cross section area and the exhaust port roof exits.
Also keep in mind the Indy heads thicker outer flange area can cause interference with some header sets, which may need
To be ground down for clearance.

Please feel free to contact us for any further questions or problems.

Hope this helps.
Ernesto Garcia
Edelbrock Tech

[Blown7]

Damn I guess Indy is the only game in town, then you have to get their blower manifold too as nothing else will fit their heads, ok I got to add another grand..........


Jeff

[Holeshot]

the Gurus feel the intake side isn't as much the problem, as the "beloved Dog Leg exhaust ports" resticting the exhaust flow out thereby restricting scavenging and intake flow during valve overlap.

The "guru" telling you about the crappy AMC exhaust port is a Honda mechanic?

"restricting scavenging and intake flow during valve overlap"????

That doesn't make a bunch of sense since you are using a blower & pushing the mix out under (low) pressure. I do believe the lower than to be expected 693 HP@5100 & 704 ft.lbs@4000 numbers could come up quite a bit with more boost &, the way I understand it, you are committed to 89 octane? Spend that kind of money & not at least mix 50-50 with 104??? I would at least look at water injection for when the knock detector senses ping.

I was just reading your list of engine mods & you say "ports equally ported to same size (what about flow?) using the Bridgeport", that doesn't quite sound like a top-notch, AMC experienced port job, & where are the flow numbers?

Most bang for the buck? How about a 304 turbo at 797HP/930ft.lbs???

Sorry, not intending to inflict insults.

NOTE: Indy SR-1 heads are a DIRECT replacement for doglegs, no spl intake required.

[Blown7]

the Gurus feel the intake side isn't as much the problem, as the "beloved Dog Leg exhaust ports" resticting the exhaust flow out thereby restricting scavenging and intake flow during valve overlap.

The "guru" telling you about the crappy AMC exhaust port is a Honda mechanic?
No Greg was the team mechanic for team Jaguar. Then started working for Reeves Callaway, doing Austin Martin racing engines, does racing Ferrari engines, and builds the hell out of Maserratis. Joe worked for Callaway too. Denny does something with a Ski Doo engine with turbos that makes 150 HP out of a 3 cylinder.

"restricting scavenging and intake flow during valve overlap"????

That doesn't make a bunch of sense since you are using a blower & pushing the mix out under (low) pressure. I do believe the lower than to be expected 693 HP@5100 & 704 ft.lbs@4000 numbers could come up quite a bit with more boost &, the way I understand it, you are committed to 89 octane? Spend that kind of money & not at least mix 50-50 with 104??? I would at least look at water injection for when the knock detector senses ping.

Well I thought of those options, but I don't want to screw around with carrying and mixing fuel when I'm away from home or running out of H2O or alcohol on a hot day on the interstate.
This is going to be a daily driver.
Absolutely more boost is the easist thing to do. Going to12- 15 lbs of boost just by changing pulleys would probably bring this thing to 800-900 HP easily
The FAST system doesn't have a option for a knock sensor thats one of the drawbacks to the FAST. I do have access the 100 LL Avgas at the airport but again I don't want to have to search away from home. Someday I want to visit MC in Minnesota and I want to just leave home with my Visa card and not have to use anything else.

I was just reading your list of engine mods & you say "ports equally ported to same size (what about flow?) using the Bridgeport", that doesn't quite sound like a top-notch, AMC experienced port job, & where are the flow numbers?

Just dumb old me making all the ports all equal size on a vertical mill and checking that all the volume all the same using H20 no flow bench. And polishing using Performance American style as a guide.
Granted not the most scientific way

Most bang for the buck? How about a 304 turbo at 797HP/930ft.lbs???

Yes fansastic! But that isn't running on pump gas is it?

Sorry, not intending to inflict insults.
And no your not in any way insulting me I like to learn and a good discussion is good for my head.
I found out one important thing, my knowledge in cylinder heads is lackingNOTE: Indy SR-1 heads are a DIRECT replacement for doglegs, no spl intake required.

Ok last time I chatted with INDY maybe we were talking about the 500 plus cu inch engine
.

[rollen dean montoya]

nice numbers :t: the engine looks great and sounded good.
better tell MC to get that timing cover to ya as it would
look really cool :lo1l: i'm really interested in seeing the dyno
sheet. when you do the inspection let us know what the results
are. have pics too!!

[Mudrat]

Damn!!! I printed a couple of your pics for the guys at work and forgot them on the f*(&^ printer 111!!!
DAMN!!
http://www.homevideos.com/freezeframes3/back2thefutureone108.jpeg

[BREK]

You starting to get old timers syndrome there Pat :mrgreen:

[Mudrat]

You starting to get old timers syndrome there Pat :mrgreen:
Today's wednesday - first time I've seen my house with the sun up in a week (for about 30 minutes), ummmm ... wednesday and already 30 hours overtime ... not old, frigg'n tired!!!

Jeep, I know I have a couple because I still have the keys on my key ring #-o ...
I think they are Green and Red, but won't swear to it. 111!!!

[dbesade]

You starting to get old timers syndrome there Pat :mrgreen:
Today's wednesday - first time I've seen my house with the sun up in a week (for about 30 minutes), ummmm ... wednesday and already 30 hours overtime ... not old, frigg'n tired!!!

Jeep, I know I have a couple because I still have the keys on my key ring #-o ...
I think they are Green and Red, but won't swear to it. 111!!!

111!!! Its Wednesday and I'm at 25 Hours of OT.. I hear you on tired.... I need to get those D44's Rebuilt... If I didn't drive my rig to work everyday...

Blown7:
I'm not any expert on AMC Engines, I know enough to keep my own stuff running, but your 401 sounded great and looks awesome. Good stuff man can't wait to see it in the CJ.

-Dave

[Dusty]

Damn!!! I printed a couple of your pics for the guys at work and forgot them on the f*(&^ printer 111!!!
DAMN!!
http://www.homevideos.com/freezeframes3/back2thefutureone108.jpeg

Look its Pat after the last 70 hours and before he had those 30 minutes at home to take a shower.

[AMX69PHATTY]

so there's about

--> 700 HP and 700 LB/FT right, in that nieghborhood ?

from an AMC V-8 with iron heads, 93 octane, and a blower ?

I don't know man that's kinda weak .............. ( kidding ) :?:

[Blown7]

UPDATE....
The engines still on the dyno, chatted with Greg yesterday he's still trying to get some more HP out of it and get it perfectly tuned.
He went to start it yesterday it started easy but the damn Carquest H2O pump was seized up soild.
He's got to change out the water pump now before he can go on.
But the end of this thread and the final numbers are still to be written......
At this point the bill is about 2800 dollars for the dyno.

Jeff

[Mudrat]

UPDATE....
But the end of this thread and the final numbers are still to be written......
At this point the bill is about 2800 dollars for the dyno.

Jeff
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: 111!!!

Damn!!!!
And I thought it was bad when the check-engine light came on in the Hemi and I was quoted, "... it'll be around $1000" #-o


Damn!!! Whered that F@<|>*^% Service adviser go 111!!!
DAMN!!
http://www.homevideos.com/freezeframes3/back2thefutureone108.jpeg



Look its Pat after the last 70 hours and before he had those 30 minutes at home to take a shower.Its630AMI'malreadyatworkandonmythirdcupofco ffeeandwillrundowntotheshipinaminutetogetadonut.Th enmayberunamarathon
andbebackforthe9AMmeetingand10AMphoneconference,an dinmysparetimebakeacake,makesomecookies,
andgetthecontractorsbackoutheretofixsomefiberconne ctions.
(transmit time 10 Nanoseconds)

[rollen dean montoya]

huh :shock:

[fuzz401]

Its 630 AM I'm already at work and on my third cup of coffee and will run down to the ship in a minute to get a donut. Then maybe run a marathon
and be back for the 9 AM meeting and 10 AM phone conference, and in my spare time bake a cake,make some cookies,
and get the contractors back out here to fix some fiber connections

[1980_Cj7]

Its 630 AM I'm already at work and on my third cup of coffee and will run down to the ship in a minute to get a donut. Then maybe run a marathon
and be back for the 9 AM meeting and 10 AM phone conference, and in my spare time bake a cake,make some cookies,
and get the contractors back out here to fix some fiber connections

Methinks you better spike your coffee with some of your racing fuel, ha, ha. Merry Christmas Fuzz!

[Holeshot]

At this point the bill is about 2800 dollars for the dyno.

You HAVE to be getting close to having put enough into this 401 to have bought an all aluminum Indy 512 inch, 840HP crate engine ($22k). Any regrets (other than the heads)???

[Blown7]

No, no regrets other than that.

I feel pretty respectable getting close to 700 HP on pump gas, on a 30 yr old engine, I learned alot, ECM is not a mystery anymore. Neither is sourcing internals and figuring what needs to be done to make serious horsepower.
For 3 grand more I can probably get way past the 814HP number if I want to.
The next engine probably will be a Indy engine.

There is nothing that comes close to the sound of a blower engine on boost!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lo1l: :t: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!:

Grown men weep, women and children are scared.


Just a update.........
The H20 pump didn't seize, The cam bolt walked out and thru the timing cover into the pump impellor. So a little welding to the timing cover is in order as well as getting the coolant moisture out of the engine.
Then back on schedule tuning.


Jeff

[1980_Cj7]

No, no regrets other than that.

The H20 pump didn't seize, The cam bolt walked out and thru the timing cover into the pump impellor. So a little welding to the timing cover is in order as well as getting the coolant moisture out of the engine.
Then back on schedule tuning.


Jeff

What do you think caused that, and what are your plans to prevent reoccurrance?

[a440plus6]

No, no regrets other than that.

The H20 pump didn't seize, The cam bolt walked out and thru the timing cover into the pump impellor. So a little welding to the timing cover is in order as well as getting the coolant moisture out of the engine.
Then back on schedule tuning.


Jeff

What do you think caused that, and what are your plans to prevent reoccurrance?

Not using Loctite caused it ....using it will cure it. I ALWAYS Loctite mine.

[Holeshot]

Ditto on the Loctite, I use it wherever there is a bolt going into a rotating/moving item - better safe than sorry!!!

Note that items doused with RED Loctite MUST be heated thoroughly, like with a propane or MAP gas torch, to come loose.

The RED is called "stud & bearing mount". Anybody ever use it on the back of a bearing shell? I suppose you would have to use it quite sparingly so as not to have any squish out & get on the journal or into the oiling groove.

[Blown7]

Yep didn't Locktite it.
Have to also check the length to make sure it didn't bottom.
I did tighten it to TSM torque spec.


Jeff