360 jeep install

[SHARPMACHINE]

Hello,

I am new here and new to amc v-8's. I have an 89 jeep yj with a 258 and a tf999. It does everything I "need", but I want more power, like everyone.

I bought a 360/727 combo out of an 86 grand wagoneer to install in my jeep. I wheel the silver lake sand dunes as well as alot of trails, very tight to open. May even climb a few rocks, as well as drive it to work occasionaly (multi purpose).

I got to hear it run and it sounded great. It has 110,000 miles on it and I am hoping not not to rebuild it before the install. Going to replace some gaskets etc... I am wondering if their is anything I should do to it before putting it into my jeep. I am looking for maintenance, repair, cheap insurance, or inexpensive modifications. Any tranny ideas would be appreciated as well. Sorry for the long post, trying to get it all in the first one??


Thanks Alot

[82Waggy]

Since you do not want to tear it down and rebuild it, it is hard to say what if anything you SHOULD do to it.

If it was me and I did not want to spend any money on it, I would at least drop the pan and look at a couple of main and rod bearings, general condition of sludge build up, rear main seal, clean the oil pick up tube, etc. Also check rod ends at the crank for signs of heat (darkened), especially number 7 & 8, as this may be an indication of a spun bearing - in which case you should tear it down and start a complete overhaul.

If the bearings don't show copper, put a new rear main seal in it, clean the pan and pick up tube, and reassamble with a new pan gasket. If you find bearing babbet material in the pan, chances are you need new cam bearings.

Then I would pull the oil pump apart and look at the condition of the inner housing for scoring and general wear. Decide if a new timing cover or pump gears is warranted, and reassemble with a stainless mid plate.

The other big deal is valvetrain wear: Timing set, cam lobes, lifters, pushrods, rockers, and of course cam bearings. If it was not making any noise you may be OK. IF you decide to remove or replace the timing cover, now would be the time to consider a new timing set, and maybe a torque cam with lifters and associated springs and such. (stock nylon geared timing sets are garbage and are known to loosen up quite a bit - nylon wears and plugs the oil system)

I assure you it is just like opening Pandora's box. If you don't really want to know what is inside, don't open it.

[82Waggy]

Regarding the tranny, the 727 is a good unit. I just rebuilt mine last week as part of my restoration project. I put in new seals, heavy duty clutches, new lock up converter, and made a few minor mods to the valve body to firm up the shift points (I will likely adjust this again after I get it running). Also installed a manual shift valve that allows you to hold any gear as long as you want or down shift at any speed(carefully).

Again, if it is not leaking or slipping and the fluid looks good, just run it as is until you really need to get into it.

[Mudrat]

Regarding the tranny, the 727 is a good unit. I just rebuilt mine last week as part of my restoration project.
Got another one laying around? Need one that fits the D300 :oops:

'Rat

[82Waggy]

Sorry rat, I only have the one tranny.

[Mudrat]

Bummer ...

Did you at least vote ? :wink:

[SHARPMACHINE]

I put in new seals,new lock up converter, Again, if it is not leaking or slipping and the fluid looks good, just run it as is until you really need to get into it.


Did your tranny already have a lock up converter, if not how did you convert it?


Also, Thanks alot for your advise.

[mika01]

Hello,
I am new here and new to amc v-8's. I have an 89 jeep yj with a 258 and a tf999. It does everything I "need", but I want more power, like everyone.
I bought a 360/727 combo out of an 86 grand wagoneer to install in my jeep. I wheel the silver lake sand dunes as well as alot of trails, very tight to open. May even climb a few rocks, as well as drive it to work occasionaly (multi purpose).
I got to hear it run and it sounded great. It has 110,000 miles on it and I am hoping not not to rebuild it before the install. Going to replace some gaskets etc... I am wondering if their is anything I should do to it before putting it into my jeep. I am looking for maintenance, repair, cheap insurance, or inexpensive modifications. Any tranny ideas would be appreciated as well. Sorry for the long post, trying to get it all in the first one??
Thanks Alot
I just finnished the exact install on my 87. Only diference is I went with a T18 stick. If you use the TF727 I'm pretty sure your NP231 will bolt up. Your shatfs will probably be shorter in the front and longer in the rear. On my 360 I swapped in some 291C heads that I ported and had rebuilt. Also that dam intake is a good boat anchor. Swap in an Edelbrock 4barel should improve performance. Then threse always the cam & timing set.

[zero cool]

I just finnished the exact install on my 87. Only diference is I went with a T18 stick. If you use the TF727 I'm pretty sure your NP231 will bolt up. Your shatfs will probably be shorter in the front and longer in the rear.

Yeah, that and the front driveshaft will be on the wrong side...


A Dana 300 bolts directly to the TF727 out of a GW and has the front driveshaft on the correct side. Though you need at least 4" of lift or a 2 piece driveshaft with carrier bearing to clear one of the hydraulic pumps on the 727.

Once you get that straightened out, the 360/727/D300 combo works great in a CJ.

[Mudrat]

Yeah, that and the front driveshaft will be on the wrong side...

A Dana 300 bolts directly to the TF727 out of a GW and has the front driveshaft on the correct side. Though you need at least 4" of lift or a 2 piece driveshaft with carrier bearing to clear one of the hydraulic pumps on the 727.

Once you get that straightened out, the 360/727/D300 combo works great in a CJ.
And that's exactly what I'm looking to do - when I can find a 727 :smile: And I have a "right" side axel - a D44 with 4.56 locker to be specific :wink:

'Rat

[mika01]

I just finnished the exact install on my 87. Only diference is I went with a T18 stick. If you use the TF727 I'm pretty sure your NP231 will bolt up. Your shatfs will probably be shorter in the front and longer in the rear.
Yeah, that and the front driveshaft will be on the wrong side...
A Dana 300 bolts directly to the TF727 out of a GW and has the front driveshaft on the correct side. Though you need at least 4" of lift or a 2 piece driveshaft with carrier bearing to clear one of the hydraulic pumps on the 727.
Once you get that straightened out, the 360/727/D300 combo works great in a CJ.
Youre right a 360/727/D300 combo works great in a CJ only problem is he has a YJ with a driver side front pumpkin. He will need either to retain Waggy T-Case (full time I think) or bolt up his old NP231 to the back of the 727. By the way Mudrat I also have a spare 727 :lo1l:

[Mudrat]

Youre right a 360/727/D300 combo works great in a CJ only problem is he has a YJ with a driver side front pumpkin. He will need either to retain Waggy T-Case (full time I think) or bolt up his old NP231 to the back of the 727. By the way Mudrat I also have a spare 727 :lo1l:
He could install a D300 flip kit and keep the gearing, steel gears (no chain) and iron case :t:

PM sent ...

[SHARPMACHINE]

Thanks everyone.

I bolted the 727 to my factory case (removed a 258 with a 999 on it). I kept the case installed so that my shafts are the same length, and installed my frame perches in that position. I did not do much to the motor before install except tappet cover gaskets.

I do have a new question today. When I got it fired up, it runs great, but has a pretty good oil leak. The oil appears to be comming from the timming cover. I originaly thought it was the intake until I watched it idle and could see a bit of oil "looked" to be comming through the top of the timming cover. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

thanks again

[ironman_gq]

they sometimes leak around the distributor. did you pull the dizzy? you might have lost the gasket or there wasn't one there.

[SHARPMACHINE]

No, I did not pull it, but I will investigate it their.


thanks

[SHARPMACHINE]

Well, it is definately the timing cover. :smile: How hard is this, and what should I check while I am in thare? I am also wondering if I should remove the grill again to do this? I am being paranoid because I have never wrenched on an amc, but have worked on a LOT of chev's and ford's. Sorry to sound silly.


THANKS FOR YOUR TIME!!!!!! :t:

[Mudrat]

Well SHARPMACHINE, we are not Chebby's or Furds :?

Pulling the fenders and grill is an EASY bit to do and will save you a lot of back-ache in the process. 11 bolts, couple wires, and some hoses and the whole front clip and radiator comes off :!:

You should probably remove at least the grill since pulling the timing cover off will be MUCH easier that way. Plus it reduces the possiblity of damage to the RAD from the fan and associated parts.

[SHARPMACHINE]

Thanks Mudrat,

I started tacking it apart last night. everything looks strait forward. Except the oil pump, the front is very much like a ford. I will more than likely change the timing chain and gears while I am inside of it. I will be looking closely to be sure I should not be doing other things while I am at it???

thanks again :razz:

[Mudrat]

Thanks Mudrat,

I started tacking it apart last night. everything looks strait forward. Except the oil pump, the front is very much like a ford. I will more than likely change the timing chain and gears while I am inside of it. I will be looking closely to be sure I should not be doing other things while I am at it???
thanks again :razz:
The oil pump and timing cover will come off together. From there you can put it on the bench and look at it under better light - well in my case I can :wink:
If you have question about what's inside or tolerances - head over to the "AMC Oiling" (http://www.bulltear.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=25) Thread. Lots good info over there.
As for other things to be looking at - yup, everything!!! #-o The timing chain, good time to swap it out with a good double roller STEEL set (I got mine from Mad Dog Racing - not sure if MC has picked up those in the store yet), sludge, carmalized oil deposits, cam ... generally check the front end. Any thing looks out of the ordinary (remember this is an AMC not one of those "other" engines and they don't look the same) shot us a mail or post up. Thre are a lot smarter AMC people than me on the board. :oops:

[SHARPMACHINE]

Howdy,

Thought I should post back how it went etc... I pulled the oil pan while doing the front cover, glad I did, it had some sluge in it. The cover and timming set change went just fine. I did not see anything to be scared of in thare, just cleaned everything well and it is good to go.

I have since done a thourough tune up with a tfi upgrade, and it did wonders. It now idles smooth and runs good, I just wish I'd done a cam while it was apart.

I just bought a spare motor to mainly store as a back-up engine. will probably add junk yard tbi and a cam to the current motor next winter??

thanks

[SHARPMACHINE]

Update after a month of use and learning.

1. My spare motor came with a 4-barrel intake and carb on it. I am now thinking of installing it. I think it would help in the dunes??

2. This 360 AMC runs great, but is thirsty. 8 mpg???

3. Could anyone explain, or point in the right direction for some training on tuning with a vacuum gage?

thanks

[fifesjeep]

Personally I'd want something super light with good torque and rpms.... Especially for a sand-buggy. I like the older Buick V-6's.... I'd love to find one and put it in my next Jeep/buggy.... Only I'd build the nuts out of it! :lo1l: .

[Penguin]

Update after a month of use and learning.

1. My spare motor came with a 4-barrel intake and carb on it. I am now thinking of installing it. I think it would help in the dunes??

2. This 360 AMC runs great, but is thirsty. 8 mpg???

3. Could anyone explain, or point in the right direction for some training on tuning with a vacuum gage?

thanks

Hey check out jeeps section and look at the thread MPG.
I posted a vacuum chart you can use.
And where in West MI are you at? I am in Muskegon area.

[cj7zrcool]

Which side chassis to motor mount has to be changed in a 258 to 360 swap in a CJ, the driver or passenger side?

[SHARPMACHINE]

fifes,

This is my only vehicle with a v-8. I wanted the big motor for the style as much as the power. This set-up is doing pretty darn good, but better is always better! lol

Penguin,

I work in Muskegon and live West of Rothbury. Thanks for the mpg suggestion, neighbore.

cj7,

I removed both factory mounts and made my own. It was easy, just a couple of plates mounted on some square tube at an aprox. 45 degree angle gets it done clean and easy.


thanks evryone

[Penguin]

Wow, you really are not that far from me.
I have all of the FSM's for 75-89 and 73 plus a few others from like 99-04. But the 99-04 are pdf's.
I just blew up my 258, but I am going to replace it with a 4.0 FL out of it looks like a 2001.
Going to switch over trannys(NV3550) at the same time.

[SHARPMACHINE]

Well, I thought I would drop in for an update after my first season running the used 360. It ended up being the most reliable of the group (mostly sbc), haha. It ran great, but I will now start planning for a cam/lifter and injection upgrade.


Cam: summit 8600, more than likely.

Injection: Junkyard tbi with re-burnt chip, or a 4-barrel (holley avenger or quadrajet)

Any advice is always appreciated.

thanks