Another cam ? but this one is for my specific 401 build.

[mika01]

You write cam speak very convincingly Sir, I just wish you or someone had some seat time or better yet a dyno print out to back up the theory part of all this. Where is it you've gotten your considerable experience if you don't mind me asking. It's very interesting to find the differing opinions between you and jeeps4ever. I really have to take note of his stated 100 AMC motor builds, of which 25 were for personal use. It's from the mild 360 build options thread you and he responded too. It seems it all comes down to your, should match up great verses jeeps4ever's Summit 8600, does work well. However, I'm not convinced either way yet. An open mind is a frustrating thing at times. thanks for you posting.

I couldn’t have put it as eloquently as you but X2

[jeepsr4ever]

Well what feels comfortable to you guys is what it really boils down to. I have enough knowledge of camshafts as 82 does to get you right where you need to be but considerations must be taken for carb type, intake, gears, vehicle weight, compression, tires...ect ...ect. One guys could be happy with a duration of 209 because he is leaning it all under 3000rpm. Others like to rod a little with a 224 duration which can work well with a performer intake a a vaccum secondary 600cfm edelbrock carb.

With enough knowledge of the moving parts and power requirements I believe me and 82 would have the same cam specs

[82Waggy]

I couldn’t have put it as eloquently as you but X2

Hey look guys, I understand your frustration. Coming on to these boards looking for advice usually leads to all kinds of varying responses. If you can pick some wheat from all the chaff you are doing good.

My background is aero engineering. My engine building experience is not nearly as extensive as MC's or some others on here, but I have built several motors of my own to include 351c'c, BBC, couple SBC's, P455, have played with various set ups on a few of those, and have worked with many other types of my friends motors. I'm currently building two AMC's for myself and used to work in a 4wheel drive shop doing engine swaps and mods on Jeeps back in high school 30 years ago (my past with Jeeps is why I have come back to it now). I know what has worked for me and others and I have done considerable research on the subject, so I don't think my experience is worthless nor do I think you will find that I have referenced anything contradictory to modern cam dynamics.

OK?

Thinking seriously of using that little green emoticon

[82Waggy]

With enough knowledge of the moving parts and power requirements I believe me and 82 would have the same cam specs

Yup.

Pretty tough to provide anything but general advice. If you want to squeek that last 30ftlbs your gonna have to do a little more homework.

"Hello, engine room, where's my drink!"

[mika01]

OK this might be a silly question, but from looking at some specs of the stock 401 cam on another board, is there really a big difference between it and the Summit 8600?

[willysworker]

Well what feels comfortable to you guys is what it really boils down to. I have enough knowledge of camshafts as 82 does to get you right where you need to be but considerations must be taken for carb type, intake, gears, vehicle weight, compression, tires...ect ...ect. One guys could be happy with a duration of 209 because he is leaning it all under 3000rpm. Others like to rod a little with a 224 duration which can work well with a performer intake a a vaccum secondary 600cfm edelbrock carb.

With enough knowledge of the moving parts and power requirements I believe me and 82 would have the same cam specs

I can sure tell you more about my needs and what I'm running for parts. What should I add to the list above? If you have the time and can help me get to that in-between you and he cam spec. Awesome. Or is it that simple, that I can just look for a cam spec'd between the Engle and Summit.

[82Waggy]

OK this might be a silly question, but from looking at some specs of the stock 401 cam on another board, is there really a big difference between it and the Summit 8600?

yup

[Blown7]

Thats why I stay out of cam advisory threads, way too much variables with different combinations to give any great advice.
Even the same cam timed differently with changes of induction will give different results. You just gotta learn for yourself.
although I do like the numbers of the Engle cam

Jeff

[82Waggy]

I'll go ahead and go out on a limb and tell you what I think the difference would be between the two cams based upon your build and set up as you have described it.

I believe the Engle will build more peak torque and do so around 3000rpm, give or take a few hundred. I beleive the summit will build less overall peak torque, the peak torque it does build will be around 3500-4000rpm, and low end will be considerably less than that of the Engle. The Engle will probably start to fall off at around 4000rpm. If you were to bump static compression up a bit, you could retain the bottom end that woud otherwise be lost with the Summit, and, in that case I would not recommend the Engle due to the likelyhood of detonation under load coming into the picture due to high cylinder pressure with pump gas. I might still choose a different grind than the 8600 if higher compression was available, however.

Now that is all relative and may be splitting hairs. Both are better than stock for building cylinder pressure.

[willysworker]

I couldn’t have put it as eloquently as you but X2

Hey look guys, I understand your frustration. Coming on to these boards looking for advice usually leads to all kinds of varying responses. If you can pick some wheat from all the chaff you are doing good.

My background is aero engineering. My engine building experience is not nearly as extensive as MC's or some others on here, but I have built several motors of my own to include 351c'c, BBC, couple SBC's, P455, have played with various set ups on a few of those, and have worked with many other types of my friends motors. I'm currently building two AMC's for myself and used to work in a 4wheel drive shop doing engine swaps and mods on Jeeps back in high school 30 years ago (my past with Jeeps is why I have come back to it now). I know what has worked for me and others and I have done considerable research on the subject, so I don't think my experience is worthless nor do I think you will find that I have referenced anything contradictory to modern cam dynamics.

OK?

Thinking seriously of using that little green emoticon

sorry, waggy didn't mean to imply your input was of less value than seat of the pants impressions. Just that the 8600 group does have a bigger voice. Really nothing personal, more about numbers of people, an experiences with AMC.
But if the two cams are really only a few HP and foot pounds apart then I have another value to weigh in. I have just found info about some manufacturing problems the 8600 might have, lobes flatting in 5,000 miles or less. That's a deal breaker, why would I even consider such a cam. Engle's cam is twice the price ($160) but maybe well worth it. I already spent $85 buck on the Edelbrock junk. Summit 8600 doesn't sound like what I want in my motor. Funny quality wasn't mentioned before. So thanks 82 waggy, I think you have shone me a winner with this cam. I've emailed Engle to get their final input. By the way, know of a cheaper place to get this cam?