Were you getting oil to the cam gear? You said they used the oil passage, so was it not spraying the Dizzy to cam gears? I'm getting plenty of oil there. I really don't want to pull the cover, but would rather do that than rebuild the engine.
Were you getting oil to the cam gear? You said they used the oil passage, so was it not spraying the Dizzy to cam gears? I'm getting plenty of oil there. I really don't want to pull the cover, but would rather do that than rebuild the engine.
Low manifold vacuum AND a 'hot' running engine upon initial start up, would generally mean 'retarded cam timing'. IMO, pull the timing cover and double check your cam sprocket keyway(s) again. Better safe than burn down your new motor.
Larry
I guess installing the Cam Sprocket on the Oil groove rather than the Keyway could be considered "retarded" ?
Not being mean, just thought that sounded funny
Man, I hope that's not the case for you dude.
They oil groove is not near as deep or tall as the Keyway
and the notch in the cam sprockets rear face wouldn't line up with the oil hole in the cam's front journal that feeds the dizzy
so if it's on wrong the dizzy wouldn't be getting any oil.
You could maybe pull a valve cover and use #1 cylinder and watch to see when the valves start to move and mark the dampener with a maker at the open and close points of the Intake and Exhaust valves. The measure the circumference of the dampener and distance between marks and calculate the angles and compare them to the cam card as an option to see if it's anywhere close. Kinda "hoakey" but would give some general idea of the cam timing and beats pulling the timing cover.
Talked to Summit, they recommend 10* BTDC on the 8600 in a 74 360 in a heavy rig like a FSJ. If the vacuum should be a minimum of 14ish?
I'm wondering if the problem I'm having adjusting the rockers would be caused by the cam being off the proper keyway. Trying to picture this. When the #1 intake is at full lift, the #6 intake lifter should ALWAYS be at the bottom of the cam lobe correct? The timing sprokets position should not effect cam to valve timing only the timing between valve openning and piston stroke?
I'm still wondering why these rocker arms are so tochy on the adjustment. If I go a 1/2 turn past 1st ristance on the turning pushrod, my vavles do not close. Any feedback?
AMX69PHATTY,
I was thinking the same thing. I'm pulling the vavle cover in the morning. I have been studying the cam and timing gears, have stock set and an old edelbrock set. I am 99% sure I did not lineup the oil hole on the keyway. I am getting plenty of oil on the dizzy gear.
The only thing I may have done is used the wrong mark on the crank. The edelbrock crank sprocket has three keyways and 6 marks. If I use the mark right above the keyway versus the mark offset from the keyway, then the when the crank came to TDC the cam would already be two teeth beyond TDC for the cam. Would this retard or advance the timing?
I checked this several times and was confident it was right before I buttoned it up. I like to think I'm not retarded, but at 4am in the garage with a mind spaner on the work bench, LOL.
Don't know, didn't really check for oil, was more concerned with what was scuffing the pistons, and had no reason to think anything was wrong with the timing gear, but, I suspect not. The divet on the back side of the timing gear was no where near the hole in the face of the cam journal, so I don't see how much if any oil could have been getting out to the front of the engine. The kicker was I test fitted all of this stuff before taking it to the machine shop, and even opened up the divet on the timing gear because it wasn't lining up with the hole in the cam to my satisfaction.Originally Posted by FullSizeJeeper
If I were you, I'd degree the cam. That's what I'm definitely doing this time when we get the engine back. I've been reading in here where many people have had to set their timing gear other than straight up just to match the specs on the cam card. Maybe that is what's happening with yours. Best of luck. Hope you don't run into what we did. Keep us posted.
I know pulling the timing cover is a PITA, but not nearly as much as pulling and rebuilding the engine again.
As far as your valves, you say you replaced the push rods with longer ones. Could they be too long and causing your adjustment problem?
It sounds like the cam is advanced a couple of teeth if I understand your description correctly.
With the #1 piston at TDC, the appropriate marks should line up. You should refer to the timing gear set instructions to determine which keyway and set of marks is used to install the cam "straight up", and then use a degree wheel to establish TDC and verify valve timing events on #1 cylinder in accordance with the cam card.
With three keyways, you should be able to install the cam "straight up", or 4 degrees advanced or 4 degrees retarded (typical options). When yo say there are six marks, I assume you mean you have three on the crank sprocket, and three on the cam sprocket. Depending upon the keyway used, you would then line up the appropriate pair of marks - the marks are matched relative to the keyway used and should line up when the piston is at TDC.
Some timing sets have more advance/retard options at varying degrees, and there is also the option of using an offset keyway to split the advance/retard degrees further.
With as much variation as there seems to be with AMC timing sets and cams, I think it wise to always use a degree wheel.
Bare Tub Restoring 69 BBB Javelin SST 390 Go/Mod Pak
Frame Off Restoring 82 Wagoneer with 401 MPEFI transplant
"First rule of government funding; Why build one when you can build two at twice the price!"
82 waggy,
There are six marks on the crank sprocket, one above each keyway and one offset for Standard, +4*, and -4*. My only concern is I used the keyway mark rather than the offset mark. I took pictures of this to have incase something like this happened, but when developed, they came out to dark to see anything. I need to get a digital camara. My camara is not as old as my jeep, but close
In that case, I think you need to go back in and verify you have chosen the correct set up. Sounds like you have the option for nine settings in 4deg increments.82 waggy,
There are six marks on the crank sprocket, one above each keyway and one offset for Standard, +4*, and -4*. My only concern is I used the keyway mark rather than the offset mark. I took pictures of this to have incase something like this happened, but when developed, they came out to dark to see anything. I need to get a digital camara. My camara is not as old as my jeep, but close
Bare Tub Restoring 69 BBB Javelin SST 390 Go/Mod Pak
Frame Off Restoring 82 Wagoneer with 401 MPEFI transplant
"First rule of government funding; Why build one when you can build two at twice the price!"
Yes, I'm going to try the valve cover trick AMX suggested above 1st. The key as I understand it is to match the cam profile to the engine. I'll do a compression check at the same time a report back this evening. Its not that hard to pull the cover, but I'm pretty sure that I have it done correctly, the symptoms are making me 2nd guess myself though
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